Need convincing

**North Light** · November 17, 2005, 06:08 AM

Re: Need convincing

Elke, I might get some stick from others for saying this, but why don't you start further up the Atkins rungs if you are worried about the changes needed for induction? Induction is meant to shock the system and break carb cravings but it may not suit everyone. Losing the low-fat habit can take some time, it has been drummed into us for so long, and if you are incredibly busy that won't help you to concentrate on he new approach. Later rungs of Atkins and the programme detailed in Atkins for Life are probably more akin to what people out there would call "healthy eating" and less difficult to fit into daily life. Just expect your loss to be slower. Why not go into "training" for induction and start by simply cutting out sugar, white flour products, bread, pasta and rice? Very simple rules and if your carbs are slightly higher you don't have to eat so much fat (I think!). Honestly, once you have done a few days you will wonder what stopped you. Good luck.

**stephbob** · November 17, 2005, 07:30 AM

Re: Need convincing

I can't begin to tell you how many times I've started and failed Atkins. Why? Simply because I feel guilty about the food I'm eating.
But this time, I was determined to do it no matter what! I've never been able to cook as much as toast before, but once I got into the know of what I could and couldn't eat, I found it became so easy to put meals together and eat properly without feeling guilty! I now eat far more vegetables than I ever have before!

It's all about getting into a routine. Once you're in, you'll be fine! The problem I found with other diets was that there was no clear line between what I could and couldnt eat, whereas with Atkins, I know exactly what I'm not allowed to eat on induction.

I promise you that it get's so much easier! The first day or two are hard, then you're ok, then by the second week you may feel like you want to give up, but if you get through that, then you'll be great!

**matawguro** · November 17, 2005, 07:58 AM

Re: Need convincing

Originally posted by elke1007

...only to feel guilty by noon for not eating "nice , healthy" low fat foods...

You're probably thinking, what if Dr. Robert Atkins was wrong about low-carb / high-fat being healthy, contrary to what others have said. That's understandable. However, he's not the only one who makes the claim that low-fat diets aren't as healthy as they're purported to be.

Here's a few links and excerpts you may want to read...

The Soft Science of Dietary Fat
by Gary Taubes

Mainstream nutritional science has demonized dietary fat, yet 50 years and hundreds of millions of dollars of research have failed to prove that eating a low-fat diet will help you live longer

What If It's All Been a Big Fat Lie?
by Gary Taubes

Now a small but growing minority of establishment researchers have come to take seriously what the low-carb-diet doctors have been saying all along. Walter Willett, chairman of the department of nutrition at the Harvard School of Public Health, may be the most visible proponent of testing this heretic hypothesis. Willett is the de facto spokesman of the longest-running, most comprehensive diet and health studies ever performed, which have already cost upward of $100 million and include data on nearly 300,000 individuals. Those data, says Willett, clearly contradict the low-fat-is-good-health message ''and the idea that all fat is bad for you; the exclusive focus on adverse effects of fat may have contributed to the obesity epidemic.''

...

Foods considered more or less deadly under the low-fat dogma turn out to be comparatively benign if you actually look at their fat content. More than two-thirds of the fat in a porterhouse steak, for instance, will definitively improve your cholesterol profile (at least in comparison with the baked potato next to it); it's true that the remainder will raise your L.D.L., the bad stuff, but it will also boost your H.D.L. The same is true for lard. If you work out the numbers, you come to the surreal conclusion that you can eat lard straight from the can and conceivably reduce your risk of heart disease.

The Truths about Saturated Fat
By Mary Enig, PhD, and Sally Fallon

These "experts" assure us that the lipid hypothesis is backed by incontrovertible scientific proof. Most people would be surprised to learn that there is, in fact, very little evidence to support the contention that a diet low in cholesterol and saturated fat actually reduces death from heart disease or in any way increases one's life span.

...

"In Framingham, Mass, the more saturated fat one ate, the more cholesterol one ate, the more calories one ate, the lower the person's serum cholesterol. . .

Lots more to follow...

**not2late** · November 17, 2005, 08:12 AM

Re: Need convincing

Originally posted by elke1007

Hi,

I do start the WOE almost every Monday , only to feel guilty by noon for not eating "nice , healthy" low fat foods.
<snip>
But that food pyramid is so stuck in my mind that I never last longer that a few hours.

Elke

Hi Elke.

I can understand your fears because we've been brainwashed by the Food Pyramid and their Grain sponsors. But consider this....

What is "unhealthy" about fresh veggies? Nothing. On Atkins we eat veggies. During Induction, it's limited to 3 cups, but according to the USDA (the makers of the Food Pyramid), 1 serving of vegetables is 1 cup raw veggie or 1/2 cup cooked veggie. Therefore on Atkins Induction, you eat between 3-5 servings of veggies per day---which is slightly more than the USDA's recommendation.

What is "unhealthy" about eating minimally processed meats, like chicken, fish, etc.? Nothing. There is a HUGE misconception that on Atkins you eat tons of greasy bacon and fatty cuts of meat. Not true at all. Dr. Atkins gave us a wide variety of animal proteins to choose for our menues. My protein is primarily from chicken, turkey, fish and seafood and the occasional soy-based product. I eat healthier protein than the people who chow down on those mystery meat containing dinners and processed chicken nuggets.

What's "unhealthy" about eating natural oils like olive oil? Nothing. A tablespoon or two of a simple salad dressing of olive oil and vinegar is all the fat you need to add to a meal. And it's healthy fat too. The low fat people want you to eat processed stuff like margarine (full of trans fats) and fake fats. The common misconception is that on Atkins you need to be eating a jar of mayonnaise with every meal. Nope. There's fat in all animal protein. So an ounce of cheese or a tablespoon of mayo or olive oil is all the fat you need to add to your meals.

Similarly, what's "unhealthy" about eating natural foods, like whole milk cheeses? Nothing. They're much better for you than eating low fat products that are filled with fillers, emulsifyers, flavor enhancers and other chemicals.

Dr. Atkins was an advocate of eating whole, natural, minimally processed and refined foods. The foods list for the diet is broad enough that we can make food choices that will conform with Dr. Atkins ideal.

**dreamof145** · November 17, 2005, 08:26 AM

Re: Need convincing

Hi Elke. You've already been given all the best advice and references by Robbie and Megs. I'd just like to tell you that I was also afraid a year and half ago when I started Atkins. However, I was afraid of dying before my grandkids grew up, and afraid of the pains and aches that I had which were associated from overweight.

I'm now over 100 pounds lighter. I've been doing the Atkins plan, exercising and taking supplements (which gives you any and all the vitamins that you are worrying about not getting in your food chain). If you do it like Dr. Atkins advised, you will feel great, lose weight and inches and increase your energy.

I hope that you read the references and re-read the book...because Atkins does work. Its changed my whole life and given me more energy than I've ever had.
Best wishes!! Keep us posted on your decision.

**Moochiecat** · November 17, 2005, 08:39 AM

Re: Need convincing

It's hard to trust something that seems to go against everything we've been taught about fats and what they do to us. A LOT of trust is involved when doing Atkins for the first month or so, but when you start seeing results, it all comes together and it's pretty darned exciting.

There's a saying "A year from now you'll wish you had started today."
Many many times (like for my 20th reunion) I thought to myself, gee, if I had started after Christmas, I'd be X pounds lighter for this! So many times I'd be filled with regret.

Dr. Atkins suggests we start the diet when we have a relatively calm 2 weeks ahead of us. Sounds like you've got a full plate, and with Christmas on the way, there's probably not a stretch of time that looks anything like being calm.
So you have some choices here:

You can choose to make the committment, and plow through it all with determination. Life is always throwing events at us like parties, meetings, unpredictable days...we do have to learn how to eat in all sorts of circumstances, so what the heck, just go for it!
or
You can choose to read DANDR, understand the diet, and then cut down on the 'bad' carbs, up your water intake, and work exercise into the mix. As someone mentioned, basically you'll be doing a higher rung level of Atkins/low carb type of thing.

The results you'll get will be different than doing the textbook Induction/OWL thing, and your weight loss will be slower, but in terms of nutrition, you'll be doing your body a favour.

The danger of doing that is if you are expecting the big losses that you hear about with folks on the 14 day Induction, it might be frustrating to you to see the scale crawl along. So frustrating that you might think there's no point to doing the diet at all. It might be best to go into this modified Atkins with the expectation of eating healthier, and any weight loss that happens will be a bonus.

So it's sort of a six of one half dozen of the other situation.
Plow through Induction regardless of what's going on in your life...bracing yourself for Induction Flu mixed in there...getting it done so you can get on that road to a smaller body no matter what the obstacle. Get that party started!

Or start making changes in your eating...more water, no sugar, no caffiene, no pasta, no potatoes, cut out the soft drinks, up your consumption of veggies, and ease yourself into eating fats like butter, mayo, creamy dressings, olive oil, etc. All these changes will add up.
You may want to check out the Low Carb Bulletin Board as well for ideas on how to wrap your head around this.

Whatever you choose, I wish you the best!

**slimndown** · November 17, 2005, 08:41 AM

Re: Need convincing

Sweetie,

I can't say anything to convince you about this WOE when you've done all the research and have seen all of the experiences on this board. All I can say is: If keep on doing what you are doing, you will keep getting what you are getting.

Start this way of eating whenever you wish. I've had refrigerator problems at times myself and I usually use an ice chest or two to keep my foods fresh. Lettuce can always be kept in a plastic tub surrounded with ice so it doesn't get wet and soggy.

Just remember: eat what meats you are comfortable with and replace all the breads and starches you eat with acceptable veggies. I may receive a little flak for saying this, but you don't necessarily have to stick with 3 cups veggies if you are not comfortable with it. Keep the cooked veggies down to 1 cup and eat a healthy salad when you feel the need. I do this in leiu of taking any fiber and the carb count on salad is minimal (2 cup salad topped with onion and cheese and dressing is around 4g net carbs).

Hope our input has helped!!!!

**k5commando** · November 17, 2005, 08:41 AM

Re: Need convincing

Obviously your not happy about how you look and feel, which is why (like everyone on this board) you started researching Atkins and found us. If your not happy then why don't you change what your not happy about? The sooner you start the sooner you'll realize you never should have put it off to begin with. Believe me, I have tried every diet around and made thousands of excuses why I was an overweight food addict. I can't tell you how many times I've kicked my own butt for not doing this 15 years ago. I'm a firm believer that you must start at the begining and do it STRICTLY by the book. I made some mistakes early on that thankfully I had people on this board to correct my mistakes and get me back on track.

I know it's said time and time again but there is no better time than now, and I know you say your schedule is hectic and I can assure you there is no way it is more hectic than mine and I've adapted and live by this WOE and will NEVER go back. After several months it becomes second nature and you won't even think about it. Our lives are always going to be busy, that will never change so you might as well commit yourself to it now so you can adjust that much quiker. You will need to commit to this way of eating and set your brain to believe there is no going back.

In 9 months I lost 70 pounds and became an excersise addict. If you had commited 9 months ago where would you be now?

**matawguro** · November 17, 2005, 09:05 AM

Re: Need convincing

Originally Posted by elke1007
...only to feel guilty by noon for not eating "nice , healthy" low fat foods...

To continue...

When I started Atkins, I believed in "low-fat is healthy" creedo. However, I thought that my obesity would kill me far quicker than any bad effects that a high-fat diet would do to me.

I went on Atkins with guarded optimism and regularly had my blood chemistry checked every six weeks. I had decided when I started Atkins that the first sign that the diet had any bad effect on me and I would quit immediately.

Lo and behold, my blood work came back better than ever. My parents were wondering how I could have such a good profile considering I was eating stuff that people believed would lead to haert attacks. They just chalked it up to me being young.

Later however, I would come across articles about how people have been misled with the low-fat hypothesis. As I kept doing Atkins, I kept reading more and more articles saying that the low-fat diet wasn't healthy at all. I've posted some of them on this thread. Here's more...

Dietary Macronutrient Ratios and their Effect on Biochemical Indicators of Risk for Heart Disease
by Loren Cordain, Ph.D

The conventional wisdom of orthodox nutritionists for the past 20-25 years... has been that a high-carbohydrate, low-fat diet is the optimal diet for humans and benefits virtually all pathological conditions ranging from heart disease to cancer. In the past 10-12 years, however, this concept has been seriously questioned... Increasingly, influential scientists (Scott Grundy, Walter Willett, Gerald Reaven) and institutions (Harvard School of Public Health) have recognized this shortcoming of high-carb, low-fat diets...

Hindu vegetarians from India whose diet is composed largely of low-fat grains and pulses (legumes) maintain CHD(Coronary Heart Disease)rates equal to [Begom et al. 1995] or higher [Miller et al. 1988] than those in the USA and countries of Europe, despite their diets' lower total fat content when compared to American and European diets.

'Healthy Diet' No Longer Defensible
by Barry Groves Ph.D

Now I feel vindicated as Dr Sylvan Lee Weinberg, a former President of the American College of Cardiology, a former President of the American College of Chest Physicians and the present editor of The American Heart Hospital Journal, in a paper published in the 4 March edition of the Journal of the American College of Cardiology, stated that these recommendations [base meals of starchy foods and "eat five portions of fruit and vegetables a day"] are no longer tenable (this has been my position for over thirty years!). Here is the abstract of that paper:

The Diet-Heart Hypothesis: A Critique

Sylvan Lee Weinberg, MD, MACC

Abstract

The low-fat "diet heart hypothesis" has been controversial for nearly 100 years. The low-fat, high-carbohydrate diet, promulgated vigorously by the National Cholesterol Education Program, National Institutes of Health, and American Heart Association since the Lipid Research Clinics-Primary Prevention Program in 1984, and earlier by the U.S. Department of Agriculture food pyramid, may well have played an unintended role in the current epidemics of obesity, lipid abnormalities, type II diabetes, and metabolic syndromes. This diet can no longer be defended by appeal to the authority of prestigious medical organizations or by rejecting clinical experience and a growing medical literature suggesting that the much-maligned low-carbohydrate, high-protein diet may have a salutary effect on the epidemics in question.

Dr. Bernstein, author of "Dr. Bernstein's Diabetes Solution" also talks about how the world has been misled about the belief that low-fat is good for you.

The Basic Food Groups
OR MUCH OF WHAT YOU’VE BEEN TAUGHT ABOUT DIET IS PROBABLY WRONG

Current dietary recommendations from the government, and nearly every “reputable” organization with an opinion, are to eat no more than 30 percent of calories as fat—which very few people can maintain—and there are some recommendations for even lower percentages than that. The current low-fat mania in our culture has spawned an increase in sugar intake. All a candy or cookie has needed is the label “fat free” to send its sales through the roof. The fallacy that eating fat will make you fat is about as scientifically logical as saying that eating tomatoes will turn you red. This is the kind of fallacious thinking behind the prevailing “wisdom,” which maintains that there is an unavoidable link between dietary protein and fat and high serum cholesterol. And that if you want to lose weight and reduce cholesterol, all you need to do is eat lots of carbohydrate, limit consumption of meat, and cut out fat as much as possible. But many contemporary researchers exploring this phenomenon have begun to arrive at the conclusion that a high-carbohydrate diet, especially rich in fruit and grain products, is not so benign. In fact, it has been shown—and it is my own observation in myself and in my patients—that such a diet can increase body weight, increase blood insulin levels, and raise most cardiac risk factors.

Low-carb diets have been labeled as "fad-diets" as if they're a new thing. The first low-carb book was written in 1863 by William Banting.

Wiliam Banting: Father of the Low-Carb Diet

For two decades 'healthy eating' propaganda has influenced the way we eat. Overthe same period there has been a consequent dramatic rise in obesity andassociated conditions. This has led to a backlash which has seen a rash of dietbooks advocating high-fat, low-carbohydrate diets described as 'new' and 'revolutionary'.

But in reality, they are not. The first low-carbohydrate diet book was written in 1863 by William Banting as a service to his fellow Man. His name passed into the language as the verb 'to bant'.

That the 'Banting diet' works has been attested to by 140 years of epidemiological studies and clinical trials.

...

In a trial at the Middlesex Hospital, London, overweight patients: * lost the most weight on a high-fat, low-carbohydrate diet
* lost the least weight on a high-carbohydrate, low-fat diet
* Lost weight even at 2,600 calories a day – but only on a high-fat diet.

...

As time passed and praising the value of fat became politically incorrect, it became more difficult to get such trials published. Nevertheless, it did happen occasionally.

Published in the year 2000, a prospective study was conducted to evaluate the effect of a low carbohydrate, high-protein/fat diet in achieving short-term weight loss. Researchers at the Center for Health Services Research in Primary Care, Durham, North Carolina, reported data from a six-month study that included fifty-one individuals who were overweight, but otherwise healthy. The subjects received nutritional supplements and attended bi-weekly group meetings, where they received dietary counselling on consuming a low-carbohydrate, high-protein/fat diet. After six months, they had lost, on average, more than ten percent of their weight and (remember this for later) their total cholesterol dropped by an average 10.5 mg/dl (0.27 mmol/l).

Twenty patients chose to continue the diet after the first six months, and after twelve months, their mean weight loss was 10.9 percent and their total cholesterol had decreased by 14.1 mg/dl (0.37 mmol/l).

Note that not once did I quote Dr. Atkins.

Bottom Line: Don't feel guilty about eating high-fat foods while on a low-carb regimen. You'll do a lot more damage to your body by eating low-fat / high-sugar foods.

**cruiser gal** · November 17, 2005, 09:07 AM

Re: Need convincing

Let's play the "What if" game that we all tend to do so regularly! What if you did nothing, and kept going the way you are now, with no control over your eating habits, and little or no exercising, where would that lead you in a year? The answer is : weight going up! You would probably feel worse than you do now, and your clothing would be getting tighter. All the everyday events would still be there, the hustle and bustle, the move to another house, Christmas holidays...which you don't have control over. What you do have control over is "What if" you started developing new eating habits, exercising, drinking 80oz of water daily, cutting your carbs, planning for your meals in advance? During the year, you would be losing weight, feeling better, looking better, and getting into smaller sizes!

You have to take little steps, and set mini goals along the route. But one thing for sure, you will feel better about yourself, both mentally and physically. So which "What if's" sounds better to you?

We're here for you to help motivate and support you, but the decision is ultimately yours to make! Procrastinating or putting off a decision we have to make, could mean we don't want to do it. But you sound like you're ready for the plunge, so just start, one small step at a time! You will succeed!

**ttdriver** · November 17, 2005, 10:16 AM

Re: Need convincing

"Nice" "lowfat" foods: fat removed and replaced with starch/sugar that make you crave more food.

What's nice about that?

Yes, its hard to understand how eating fat can be healthy, but its alot harder to understand how eating sugar is!!

Betty

**nobodyknowsme** · November 17, 2005, 10:27 AM

Re: Need convincing

Hi there,

If I were you, I would really first determine whether or not you have the time to commit to switching to a low-carb way of eating. God knows if your schedule is hectic, it might be hard to find the time to adequately shop for, prepare, and cook your own meals and snacks...which is really the best way to go. It is possible to get by by grabbing something at the store, but this can be tricky. Many times I get frustrated by not finding something and then I end up not eating at all which just makes it worse.
If your mind and schedule are not prepared for all the changes, the best thing to do is wait until things have calmed down and you can do it the RIGHT way. You will feel and know when it is the right time.

**cosguy21** · November 18, 2005, 02:24 AM

Re:BE CONVINCED

I've only been on this new adventure...(it is an adventure when you like to cook......I like making up and trying new recipes) for 2 weeks. I have lost 18lbs....God only knows how many inches I have lost.....actually I almost losted my pants at work the other day in front of one of my clients EMBRASSING........ besides the physical changed going on with my body another thing I have notice is what's happening inside...... I use to wake up 2-3 times a night out of a dead sleep with heart burn soooooooo incredibly bad that it would take some times 30 minutes to get it under control and that was with prescription acid pills.............I have not risen once during the night since I been on this adventure and that prescription is collecting dust on my nightstand....... in mho, this new way of life is a life saver, and a sleep saver.....I feel rested when I wake up, not cranky or tired......I feel more energetic....the list goes on and on...... the hardest part of starting this diet was the first 4 days when I craved carbs, after that it's so easy.....it's not even like being on a diet at all now. Plus the awesome people here on this board will answer any questions you might have....even the embrassing ones.....LOL

**tripped** · November 19, 2005, 05:03 PM

Re: Need convincing

Everything everbody else said.............especially, like me, what if you continue doing what you're doing because it's supposedly acceptable? Why don't you try one week? You can probably cope with the refrigerator for one week. I will be on this two weeks Monday. I feel much better already just getting rid of some little aches and pains as somebody else already mentioned. I've been keeping it as simple as possible, nothing fancy, nothing where it's not obvious that it's ok to eat -- basic meats, tuna, salads, vegetables, and plenty of water. This way I'm not tripping myself up and making mistakes that could cost me.

I think if you try it for a week, you may get your own personal positive reinforcement to be able to make a longer commitment. Good luck!!

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