Don't want to lose weight

[Georgiana]

Re: Don't want to lose weight

I have read DANDR cover to cover. Since I live in Europe, from my experience, the delivery of a book I order in American will take a couple of months.

Amazon does not deliver DANDR from the US, but from a European country (usually the UK). I live in Germany and it took 6 days to get mine.

Just experimenting, feeling sick and finding out I don't tolerate lot of foods.

Experimenting with what? Can you tell us all the new foods you experimented with, the time of day when you had them, what you had them with, in what amounts and how often you had them, and what other foods you ate that day? Or better give us your complete menus for the past week. Include quantities (measured raw) for absolutely everything and separate your foods between meals. For e.g.:

Breakfast
2 large eggs
1 oz Swiss cheese
1 cup mushrooms

Lunch
.......
.......

Dinner
.......
.......

[Georgiana]

Re: Don't want to lose weight

Yes but someone suggested Atkins for Life is different.

Oh, and unless you got this in a PM, what you were told in the forums is that the Maintenance Phase in DANDR is the same as the one in "Atkins for Life".

Or maybe I just can't find the post you're referring to, in which case it would be great if you could post the link here or PM it to me---it's bad to have information which is so obviously wrong, because it can mislead some of our members.

[ziggy]

Re: Don't want to lose weight

try eating lots of eggs/butter/red meat that will boost your natural testosterone production and Growth Hormone and IGF-1

when red meat is cooked to much it loses its Creatine so try to eat it somewhat raw just cook the outsides and leave the middle raw like chiefs do

but also make sure you smell the red meat before cooking it to know if its good
Will A Low Carb Diet Raise Or Lower Cholesterol? | MuscleHack

also if you have never ate red meat in a long time it may take your stomach awhile to adjust i remember when i did not eat it for along time when i started eating it again my gut was uncomfortable but it quickly got better now i eat it all the time


also i find eating broccoli as a nice vegetable

your thin and your body needs to build up but dont expect it to happen over night give it a few months infact it took me 6 months for my horrible life threatning gut diseases to be cured on the Atkins diet so these things take time

also do full body muscle work outs i got ALOT more energy since going to the gym and working all my muscles

also for me i stay at Rung 2 75% of the time 3 out of 4 days about but the other time i go to Rung 4 tops

so i feel great at just Rung 2 and i eat just 20-60 carbs a day i never pay attention to it just meat eggs broccoli butter feta cheese is the main foods i eat mostly always

the days i eat berries or nuts il be at like 50-60 carbs

the Rungs in the Atkins diet are to help you figure out things it says in the book and CCL and such some people like going to Rung 9 and eating whole wheat and 100 carbs a day while others like sticking to Rung 2-4 and eating about 50 carbs a day

[Riverj]

Re: Don't want to lose weight

Amazon does not deliver DANDR from the US, but from a European country (usually the UK). I live in Germany and it took 6 days to get mine.

Experimenting with what? Can you tell us all the new foods you experimented with, the time of day when you had them, what you had them with, in what amounts and how often you had them, and what other foods you ate that day? Or better give us your complete menus for the past week. Include quantities (measured raw) for absolutely everything and separate your foods between meals. For e.g.:

Breakfast
2 large eggs
1 oz Swiss cheese
1 cup mushrooms

Lunch
.......
.......

Dinner
.......
.......

Six days is quick! I ordered a low glycemic load cookbook from amazon and it took 3 months and two weeks. Last time I ordered a DVD from amazon.de it took 5 weeks to be delivered.

Anyway I have the DANDR and will just re-read the maintenance chapter just in case. I have experimented with yams, sweet potatoes, corn, turnips, brown rice, kidney beans, garbanzo beans, peas, whole wheat bread, whole wheat pasta, barley, quinoa, amaranth, kamut, buckwheat, lentils, milk. I test first the food on its own and then in a meal. At lunch they have even worse effects than in the evening, when my blood sugar stabilizes a bit, so I tested them at dinner mostly.

I haven't kept a food diary of everything I have eaten lately.
Also I have never measured anything, I don't weight foods or count calories, that's Atkins' prerogative after all. When I test new carbs I test a small amount so that the GL is less than 10. So corn was half a cob, yam was half a potato, turnip was a small one, brown rice was 1/3 cup, quinoa was 5 tablespoons before cooking, legumes is 1/2 cup, milk was a small glass.

Today I had on omelette in the morning made with two eggs, fried in half butter and half olive oil. The filling was sliced and cooked zucchini and leek stir fried in butter. On top of the zucchini I added sliced swiss cheese and a piece of pork fat. Twenty minutes after eating this I had already symptoms of blood sugar instability: feeling like crying for no reason, spaciness and forgetfullness, blurred vision and headache. I started sweating and feel lightheaded and I had ringing in my ears.

[Georgiana]

Re: Don't want to lose weight

I have experimented with yams, sweet potatoes, corn, turnips, brown rice, kidney beans, garbanzo beans, peas, whole wheat bread, whole wheat pasta, barley, quinoa, amaranth, kamut, buckwheat, lentils, milk.

Great. Let me see if I get this right. Two weeks ago you were on OWL Rung 7. For the past two weeks you've gone through OWL Rung 8 and Rung 9, testing 13 (if I counted right) foods from these levels. Is this correct?

I test first the food on its own and then in a meal. At lunch they have even worse effects than in the evening, when my blood sugar stabilizes a bit, so I tested them at dinner mostly.

Okay. Let's take brown rice, for example. So you've eaten it on its own first (e.g. 1/3 cup brown rice with nothing else for that meal) and then with some food (e.g. 1/3 cup brown rice and 5 oz steak with some green veggies). Do I understand this correctly? Also, did you do both tests in one day or in separate days?

I haven't kept a food diary of everything I have eaten lately.
Also I have never measured anything, I don't weight foods or count calories, that's Atkins' prerogative after all. When I test new carbs I test a small amount so that the GL is less than 10. So corn was half a cob, yam was half a potato, turnip was a small one, brown rice was 1/3 cup, quinoa was 5 tablespoons before cooking, legumes is 1/2 cup, milk was a small glass.

Do you know how many net carbs are in 1/3 cup of brown rice or in 5 tablespoons of quinoa? Are you counting carbs at all?

[Riverj]

Re: Don't want to lose weight

Great. Let me see if I get this right. Two weeks ago you were on OWL Rung 7. For the past two weeks you've gone through OWL Rung 8 and Rung 9, testing 13 (if I counted right) foods from these levels. Is this correct?

To be honest I just forgot about rungs and tested the foods, so it is correct but I didn't make it precisely and gradually. I just threw the baby with the bath water and experimented. I was just angry and frustrated.

Okay. Let's take brown rice, for example. So you've eaten it on its own first (e.g. 1/3 cup brown rice with nothing else for that meal) and then with some food (e.g. 1/3 cup brown rice and 5 oz steak with some green veggies). Do I understand this correctly? Also, did you do both tests in one day or in separate days?

Exactly and I tested in separate days.

Do you know how many net carbs are in 1/3 cup of brown rice or in 5 tablespoons of quinoa? Are you counting carbs at all?

Yes, I do count carbs. 1/3 cup of brown rice has 15 grams of carb, a GL of 7 and a GI is 80. 5 tablespoons of quinoa have 22 grams of carbs and a GL of 10.

[Georgiana]

Re: Don't want to lose weight

To be honest I just forgot about rungs and tested the foods, so it is correct but I didn't make it precisely and gradually. I just threw the baby with the bath water and experimented.

... but the baby drowned.

Alright. So, what you're doing right now is kicking your own and complaining that it hurts. Keep reading...

Exactly and I tested in separate days.

Of course you'll get blood sugar symptoms if you eat 1/3 cup of rice or whatever without anything else! That's why our meals should be balanced and carbohydrates, even when coming from vegetables, should be consumed together with fat and protein.

Yes, I do count carbs. 1/3 cup of brown rice has 15 grams of carb, a GL of 7 and a GI is 80. 5 tablespoons of quinoa have 22 grams of carbs and a GL of 10.

If you add 22 g net carbs from quinoa and 15 g net carbs from brown rice, you shouldn't be surprised that your blood sugar goes awry. These foods should be tested in OWL in 5 g net carbs amounts, not 15-25. Even in Pre-Maintenance you should only add them in 10 g net carb amounts.

I'm sorry, but while the diet you're following is indeed low carb, it is not Atkins. You would do yourself a huge favor by re-reading the book, because you clearly forgot a lot of what you've read there and this has caused you a lot of trouble. In the meantime, eat whatever foods you can tolerate, but increase your calories---as long as your caloric intake is higher than your total energy expenditure, you will stop losing weight and if you go up high enough with the calories, you will even gain a few pounds.

[Riverj]

Re: Don't want to lose weight

I'm sorry, but while the diet you're following is indeed low carb, it is not Atkins. You would do yourself a huge favor by re-reading the book, because you clearly forgot a lot of what you've read there and this has caused you a lot of trouble. In the meantime, eat whatever foods you can tolerate, but increase your calories---as long as your caloric intake is higher than your total energy expenditure, you will stop losing weight and if you go up high enough with the calories, you will even gain a few pounds.

After reading the book, where do you think I should start again from?
Maintenance or OWL? How do I know what carbohydrates source I can tolerate and what I can't?

[mitzimarie]

Re: Don't want to lose weight

In the meantime, eat whatever foods you can tolerate, but increase your calories---as long as your caloric intake is higher than your total energy expenditure, you will stop losing weight and if you go up high enough with the calories, you will even gain a few pounds.

Perfect advice, Georgiana. Even in Maintenance, I have to eat mostly at Rung 1... I occasionally have berries, but that's about all I can get away with. I don't have the kind of blood sugar symptoms that Riverj describes when I eat from the other rungs, so much as I have portion control issues. So I am living, breathing proof that you can eat from Rung 1 and not lose (and maybe even gain a few pounds!) when calories are increased enough.

And, no, I don't believe "a calorie is a calorie"... meaning, I don't believe that it is a straight up case of calories in, calories out. HOWEVER, just because Atkins said that you don't count calories, that doesn't mean that calories don't count. If you eat enough of them, you can halt your weight loss.

[mitzimarie]

Re: Don't want to lose weight

How do I know what carbohydrates source I can tolerate and what I can't?

No one can tell you that, as we are all quite unique. That is the purpose of following OWL in a carefully controlled, precise manner. As Georgiana pointed out, you are only to test new foods in 5g increments... and you are supposed to test them 1 food at a time, and always balance them with protein/fat (never alone!). Yes, this takes a lot of time and patience, but how else will you learn exactly which foods are tripping you up, if you don't?

You've never found your CCLL (Critical Carbohydrate level for Losing), correct? I would start there. Since you fear foods other than Induction foods, go ahead and increase your carbs with those foods each week until you find the threshhold at which you stop losing (primarily from extra veggies). Then, I would start testing new foods (one at a time, in the order of the carbohydrate ladder or rungs) in 5g increments, for a week at a time.

You sound like you've already made up your mind that you can't eat anything other than Induction foods. If it turns out that is the case, you will have to either eat enough of them to reach your CCLM (Critical Carbohydrate Level for Maintaining), or you will have to eat enough calories to halt your weight loss. Personally, I would first try to follow OWL correctly (which you haven't done yet) before giving up on all foods from the other rungs.

[Georgiana]

Re: Don't want to lose weight

How do I know what carbohydrates source I can tolerate and what I can't?

While you read the book, you should keep eating the way you ate until May 27, because you said your blood sugar was stable then. So you can have veggies, cheese, nuts, strawberries... plus whatever else you were eating until then that wasn't causing you problems. The only thing you should do is eat more without eating new foods. Eat small meals more often as this will reduce the probability to get blood sugar symptoms. Exercising also helps with this, so make your Atkins complete by doing the exercise (cardio and weight training) part.

You once wrote your doctor told you to eat more. Ask him/her how many calories you should be eating. Then add 200-300 to that number (that's because there are studies that have shown one can eat a couple hundred calories more and still lose weight when carbs are restricted) and see how your weight changes at that calorie level. If you still lose weight, increase your calories by another few hundred. Also keep a food journal that you can show to your doctor, so that he/she sees what and in what amounts you are eating.

After reading the book, where do you think I should start again from?
Maintenance or OWL?

After you read the book, I think you should test new foods properly (in smaller amounts, with fat & protein, etc.) while keeping your calories high. Or if you decide you prefer eating at lower carb levels, then just keep your calories high enough to avoid losing more weight.

If you want to lose no more weight, you won't be able to determine your CCLL, because you'll have to "overeat" or eat enough carbs to keep your weight steady. If I were you, I'd first figure out the calorie and carbohydrate levels at which I'd stop losing weight. Then start experimenting with new foods and increase the carb level by eating small amounts of these new foods. If a new food causes you blood sugar symptoms, you should obviously drop it. Alternatively, you could add more carbs from the foods you were eating before, foods which you know you can tolerate. Whichever strategy you decide to follow, once you reach a certain (personal!) carbohydrate level, you will start gaining weight. This will be your CCLM---above this level you'll gain weight, while below it you'll stay the same or lose (assuming you keep your calories and activity level relatively constant and your sources of carbohydrates more or less the same). Once you reached this point, you can gain some weight by eating more calories, by eating more carbohydrates, by redistributing your sources of carbohydrates, by gaining some muscle, etc. In any case, you will know where you have to be in order to maintain and what you have to eat in order to avoid blood sugar symptoms, which at the moment are the two problems you have.

[Riverj]

Re: Don't want to lose weight

Any advice on how to raise calories without stretching the budget?
Eating twice the serving sizes of meat would be too expensive

I will let you know how I'm doing

[Georgiana]

Re: Don't want to lose weight

Any advice on how to raise calories without stretching the budget?
Eating twice the serving sizes of meat would be too expensive

I will let you know how I'm doing

Post some of your current menus (include quantities for everything) and then we can make suggestions starting from what you're already eating.

[ziggy]

Re: Don't want to lose weight

Riverj some people can be allergic to eggs maybe you should get a test to see what your body is allergic too unless you have ate eggs plain before and had no problems

[Georgiana]

Re: Don't want to lose weight

As I understand, Riverj has been eating eggs before without any issues (from his May 27 posts).

Here are more questions for you, Riverj.

I suffer from low energy, fatigue, mood swings, insomnia, anxiety. The typical ailments of modern western life.

Did you seek help from a mental health professional for some of these problems?

My problem with Atkins is that I can't find a middle ground.

As I've said in my previous post, that's because the way you've been adding carbs back is not how you should have done it if you were following Atkins.

Can you open your book on page 89 and check #1 and #2 there? And then open it on page 112 and read the section that starts there? Also, just to make sure we're talking about the same book, could you tell me what you have on this pages in your book? I wouldn't want to give you advice from a different book as your problems are already very serious.

You said you're tracking your carbs. So can you post here a graph showing your carbohydrate intake since you began low carbing? Like, day on the x-axis, carb intake on the y-axis?

When I restrict carbs I lose my appetite to the point I never feel like eating and skip meals all the time.

When I eat more carbs I can't stop being hungry all the time and eating slice after slice of bread.

What does "more" mean? More than what? More by how much? And from what foods?