Atkins and Psychology...

[Slidesdownmountains]

Long one - sorry, bear with me....!

Am just wondering what everyone feels about the psychology of why we eat the things we know make us overweight and ill?

I always feel great and in control when I am in ketosis or have been on track for a while, but I have fallen off the wagon about 8 times now after months and months of successful weight loss faithfully following Atkins - several of those quite seriously, where I have gained nearly all the weight back.

I have read and re-read the book several times over, and feel that I always give it my best shot, full of optimism, and never want to fall back to my old bad habits again, but each time I have surprised and disappointed myself.

I can't help but feel that this is due to some kind of psychological element? I know full well what is good for me and what is not, and I know what triggers cravings for me, too - so on paper I should be successful - so how come I keep letting myself down?

I know that arming myself with the knowledge of how Atkins works, how our blood sugars work and the ways in which we can control them is one of the most powerful tools we have to future success, but I personally also think that each individual has different reasons and different patterns in how they got to this point: Poor eating habits growing up, self-destructive behaviours etc - perhaps a cognitive behavioural therapy approach is useful to some??

I know there are a lot of people out there who [lucky devils] just see food for what it is - a necessary fuel, some more enjoyable than others, and eat good foods to feel great, and they fuel their bodies in a healthy way. They eat until satiated and then stop, and don't really think about food in any great way again until they are hungry.
I would LOVE to be like this, with a calm and laissez-faire attitude toward food, but I find food very much linked to emotion - particularly feelings of guilt, resentment, joy and stress.

For instance, I find certain foods make me crabby and some give me almost a feeling of euphoria when I initially eat them.
If I want a certain food and I am denied it, it will make me irritable, but often if I do eat it, I will be overwhelmed with guilt.
I also eat in times of stress and boredom, and sometimes, because I know would look greedy to others, I shamefully eat in secret.

I'm sure none of this is ground-breaking, headline stopping news, and I could be speaking for many hundreds of people out there but I just wonder why?
Where have these links been forged??
Is it due to food being treated as a reward for good behaviour or comfort when I have been upset growing up?

Has anyone found that looking into their own habits and behavioural mechanisms has benefitted them?
Is there a place on this site where we can discuss and advise on the more psychological aspects of our eating habits?

I feel like I can treat the outcome of my poor eating habits so far by sticking to this WOE, which is excellent - but I feel like I also would like to solve the root causes, too.

[Slidesdownmountains]

Re: Atkins and Psychology...

God - just realised how many 'I's were in that... it's all about me....yada-yada!! LOL

[Whatsername]

Re: Atkins and Psychology...

I am very big on psychology and eating (and in general). I have a degree in psychologry but never went far enough with it to really study eating habits.

I see myself in so much of what you wrote. I remember when I wasn't on Atkins getting irritated about not eating certain things...then I would find a reason or excuse to eat it. Then usually feel guilty. For the 6 years I wasn't on Atkins before now, one of my usual mindsets was "you only live once and what does my weight really matter, I am going to enjoy food and eat what I want". I also went through a lot of negative thinking and figured it just didn't matter what I looked like.

I was on Atkins in 2003 and like you, I did well on it but fell off the wagon. I KNEW it was good for me but for some reason (many reasons I think), I just pushed all that aside and ate. I don't know exactly how or why it took me 6 years to try this again.

I have been in CBT (cognitive behavioral therapy) for a while for other reasons. It has made a big difference in my life so maybe that did have something to do with it. Me feeling differently (and better) and believing I can do this and deserve to do it.

For me, I think it was just a lot of negative thinking about my life in general but food was one way I had control over it (even if it was a negative thing and I was overeating). I am sure I used food to try to make myself feel better.

It is interesting...I will think more about this but have to run for now!

Take care,
Jane

[mizski]

Re: Atkins and Psychology...

It's been two years since I started to seriously try losing weight. First was with Medifast, then South Beach and now Atkins. I lost a lot of weight with Medifast but had to stop when I developed severe soy sensitivities. Then I gained 60#s after the death of my parents and several other family members. So earlier this year I went on South Beach which was a good diet but was more like a maintenance plan for my body with all its carbs. And now I'm here.

The point of my little history is that I found that I can do diets well...I research the plan, decide if it will fit into my lifestyle and then follow that plan religiously. But as I discovered with the loss of my family and subsequent poundage piling, there are some underlying issues that needed to be addressed.

Because the title intrigued me, I bought and read, If I'm So Smart, Why Can't I Lose Weight? It helped me to discover that I used food, particularly restaurant fine dining, as a reliable and faithful friend who was always there and seldom let me down. When I was caregiver to Mr. Ski during his bone marrow transplant, rather than dealing with those scary emotions, I chose food. When I was caregiver to my aging parents, rather than dealing with those emotions and incredible busyness of trying to help them while still doing my own life things, I chose food. Rather than dealing with loss and its resulting emptiness, I chose food. It is a continual effort to not do that at times but that book gave me some very useful tools to use. It has helped a lot and I am slowly breaking away from my old habits.

For many of us, it is important to find (and correct) the "why" we got fat. For some it is a simple "you ate too much" or "you ate the wrong things." They can lose weight and move on with their lives. For others, like me, it is crucial to work on that "why" or else dieting is just an exercise in what-to-eat food lists.

There are a zillion books on the subject out there. I happened to like this one; others I know like The Beck Diet Solution.

[Slidesdownmountains]

Re: Atkins and Psychology...

Thanks, Jane - glad to hear your CBT is going well.
Good to know I am not going mad or am some kind of greedy freak!

It is interesting what you say about negative thinking - I have been thinking about this and noticing it a lot of late: perhaps it is a by-product of my living in Central London where everyone hates everyone they don't know and is quite a dour and angry place (in my opinion anyway! perhaps it is just the underground?!!)
I think I try to be optimistic, as a rule, and can't bear being around negative people for very long, but obviously, I am human and do get down about some things and find that negative thinking produces a downward spiralling effect.

Thanks for your thoughts

[Slidesdownmountains]

Re: Atkins and Psychology...

hey Mizski

Thanks for your reply - so sorry to hear about the hard times you've been going through.

I will look that book up - am always interested in ideas and theories about these sorts of things. It wouldn't surprise me if I wasn't dealing with emotional issues and burying them with food - I went to a hypnotist once just for an initial consultation and ended up crying for a solid 30 minutes once I started talking about myself!!! It's such a weird sensation talking to a stranger about some of the most emotional parts of your life!

[trock]

Re: Atkins and Psychology...

You just described me to a T

i have done atkins numerous times, always with success and BAM somehow i end up regaining it all and then some, only to start over, lose it, feel great and BAM off we go again

this last time i went from 308 to 238 and 225 was my initial goal. sooooo close

now i am over 290 again, feel horrible and am miserable

i will be starting again soon

but aside from the obvious self destruction is also, for me, the knowledge that atkins is extremely hard to do for me. i travel a ton, and am busy eating on the fly, don't cook well, and get sick quite quickly of eggs, bacon, wings etc

anyway, i have no idea if/when i will start again but i knwo i can drop it, but i have no idea how to get to my goal (210 permanent) and keep it off

its DEF in my head as much as anything else

good luck!

[Slidesdownmountains]

Re: Atkins and Psychology...

Hi Trock - glad to hear you're back on the wagon (more than can be said for me right now! Just had a slice of malt loaf and a packet of crisps: feeling unwell so my mood is dictating that I eat for comfort... and I am enforcing this by repeating the behaviour! terrible!)

I think for some people perhaps they need to sort out certain other habits and issues in order to be more successful with their diet - or perhaps being successful with eating would lead to more healthy behaviours? Obviously, I am not 100% perfect at this: have been on and off atkins about 18 times now. I am a clever girl, and I am very disciplined at certain times - so why can I not maintain it?
Answers on a postcard please!

Best of luck, Trock - you can do it!

[Suzanne_H]

Re: Atkins and Psychology...

Mizski, I was thinking as I read your posts that I see so much of myself in there... ever the caregiver... yet I give such little care to myself. And the less care I give myself the less I can care for others as I'm no longer capable of what I used to be...

Just "chewing" on those thoughts at the moment as I finish breakfast. It's so good to know I'm not alone.

[Momma2threegirls]

Re: Atkins and Psychology...

I could ahve written your post. For me I am possitive there is an underlying issue. I can loose weight great on any diet - it's all about control. The problem is I get down to my "goal" and then I still ahve the issues. So I gain and then eventually drop again. I have lost over 100# twice now. I recently read

When Food is Love by Geneen Roth. It was fabulous - I cried through the book - it is SO me. It hit really close to home for me.

She has several other books. one is amaintance sort of book and another is a concept book on how to stop the cycle of abusing food. I promised myself when I get back to goal that I would purchase and read the next book.

But truthfully I am terrified to eat differently - b/c I loose control and the cycle starts again. Only at the end of all the mess....I am still miserable and up (usually really up) in weight. I am "hoping" it will be something I can incorporate Atkins maintance and apply the Atkins mindset to......I haven't researched the problem solving book. But the book I listed about is very much a psychology perspective on the "why" of the issues.

[MellyG]

Re: Atkins and Psychology...

Wow, what a complex topic! I'm a therapist and have been involved in a number of conversations about the eating issues (both with clients about theirs and with friends about mine!) I think what Jane said about not thinking you can achieve success or that you deserve success can be a biggie for a lot of people. Having so much of your identity wrapped up in caring for others, as another member mentioned, can also be a big factor for some.

The big thing for me, though, is that feeling or "high" food can give you. Many junk foods trigger the release of natural opiate-like chemicals in the brain. It's like heroin!! For many people, this is the most effective method of relaxation and emotion regulation they have used. It's hard to give up the thing that's been most effective. Junk food is a very powerful emotion regulation tool and we need to have compassion for ourselves and the tough stuff we're trying to eat away!

If you've been doing Atkins and haven't learned non-binging/junk fooding ways of coping with your emotions, you are likely to "relapse," in my opinion. Were the times you have gone back to the non-Aktins woe particularly stressful ones? Did you feel better physically while on Atkins, but feel that tension or emotional pressure was building from not being able to get that food high? I know it's happened to me in the past.

There are a number of things you can practice in place of eating junk food when you feel that emotional pressure building. For some people, self-soothing with things like music, baths, breathing exercises, or special non-food treats can be really helpful. For others, sitting with those feelings and practicing some mindfulness can help them work through the feelings instead of pushing them away (if the thought of sitting with your feelings sounds scary, this may be something that is especially key for you). A lot of people need something that is physiologically jarring at those times that they feel like running to junk food. Things such as taking a cold shower, holding an ice cube, sprinting, or dipping your face in ice water can literally tip your body chemistry enough to turn down the intensity of the emotion so it is more bearable. Finally, you should alter your environment if you can by removing trigger foods, practicing assertiveness in difficult relationships, planning time in your day for cooking or exercising, etc, etc, to both reduce your stress and increase your chances of success.

There are SO many factors and so many things that can be helpful!!!!!

Hang in there everyone!

[Slidesdownmountains]

Re: Atkins and Psychology...

Erika and Melinda - thanks for your posts! very interesting about the opiate-like chemicals, because you do hear people saying that they feel food is a drug a lot of the time, and this ties in with the feeling of being addicted.

Melinda - what kind of therapy do you practice? Do you practice these sorts of techniques yourself?

I find that I buckle most in situations where I am in a bad mood, stressed, tired or out of a routine, especially when on holiday (for instance, I went to Italy for a friend's wedding and [admittedly though I didn't try VERY hard], there were not a massive amount of places to eat, and they were all very typically italian fare: bread, pasta, pizza, pudding... there's only so much antipasta, olives and mozzarella you can eat in one day (nitrates and cheese limits notwithstanding!) and so I have crashed and burned since then and am finding it very hard to get back on track. Often, I will write off a whole week saying I will start next Monday or something, but then fail to do so. Am still exercising but can definitely feel my weight gain slowing me down and a little tightness in the clothes - need to get a grip on myself: don't like feeling so guilty and unfit!

What advice do you have for work place eating scenarios (for instance, the almost constant stream of birthdays in the office apparently demand a stream of krispy kremes, Paul's cakes, Mark & Spencers goodies and Pringles....! I can smell them!!! I certainly can't take a bath, and I hate feeling like I'm being un-friendly for someone's birthday, but haven't quite come up with a satisfactory answer if I want to refuse some confectionary!

Also, what if I have to go to Italy again with their Tiramisu, Gelato and Calzone looking so beseechingly at me....! ;-)

[RosieC]

Re: Atkins and Psychology...

The office birthdays thing: In the last place I worked, the format was that the birthday person would arrange their goodies in the office kitchen and then send round an email to announce that it was there. So not only were you not faced with a person pushing cake at you, you even had a warning by email to stay out of the kitchen for the rest of the day.

How about sneakily hinting to the office manager that the birthday person seems to have to spend a lot of time handing round the cakes and wouldn't it be more efficient to do it the kitchen & email way? Or if your own birthday is coming up, do it that way and hope it catches on?

I know this doesn't solve the underlying problem. For me, I'm sure that particular situation is related to wanting to please, and finding as a child that I could please my mother by eating what she had prepared for me. This makes it extremely hard to say no when anybody is asking me to eat something in a one to one situation.

[Slidesdownmountains]

Re: Atkins and Psychology...

Thanks Rosie - this would work if only we weren't sat right next to the open-plan tea/coffee area where everyone deposits their goods! Hahaha - am up against it at work! :-/ One time they spent £160 on these beautiful pastel-coloured-icing muffins each the size of a baseball for someone's leaving do *sigh*
I try my best but it is a sugar-fest in here most days

[MellyG]

Re: Atkins and Psychology...

I do a kind of cognitive therapy called Dialectical Behavioral Therapy. It was designed for individuals with a lot of difficulty regulating emotions, but as it turns out, emotion regulation is something a lot of us need help with. In DBT, therapist do practice coping skills along with clients so I do use a lot of these things in my life.

I know that exercise is very effective when I'm stressed and that's something I need to do more of! I most often use mindfulness skills during challenging situations, though. One game I'm starting to play with food is called "urge surfing." My husband has TONS of carbage in the house that he is constantly eating (but he has a great metabolism). I'm currently working on mentally stepping back and observing the urges to eat junk and just noticing how the rise and fall, sometimes repeatedly, before they go away. It makes a difference to look at these experiences with willingness to work with them as well as intellectual curiosity rather than freaking out that the urges are there.

Rosie and Slides, do people at your work know you have quit junk food. If they do, you don't need to constantly explain your choices. If not, that may be something to think about, both why you haven't told them or how you will tell them. I haven't told people "I'm doing Atkins" because I know about all the misconceptions out there about the woe. I have told people, though, "I'm going to be a pretty picky eater from now on" and explained about cutting most carbs initially and then reintroducing to see which I respond well to and which I don't. People don't realize that this is what Atkins is!!!

It's also very likely, Slides, that others are eating more than they would like with a table of goodies right out in the open for you to see and smell all the time!!!! I would take an office poll and, if others do have trouble and there is another place for it, see if that stuff could be moved.

It's tough, though, isn't it?! We're trying to change some very deeply ingrained habits! I think the increased assertiveness, self-care, and emotional coping skills that successful Atkins folks pick up along the way are what can make this journey truly life changing for many of us. It's not just about the weight loss, for sure.