Not really convinced about net carbs...

[G-Mom]

Ok, this is something I have wanted to discuss with everyone. I am not exactly convinced that we can always discount the fiber carbs in certain foods. My case in point: Low carb hot cereal. This is the CarbSense Mini-Carb stuff that has these ingredients: soy protein concentrate, wheat bran, flax seed meal, pumpkin seed flour, spices, salt.

Well, it says that in one serving, there are 15g carbs with 12 g fiber, for a 3 net carb total. Now as net carbs go, this is a good choice for those of us in the grain rung of OWL. However, when I did an experiment and ate one serving about 3 times per week (changed nothing else) I stalled out like crazy. I did this for about 3 weeks (to give it a chance), then decided to take it out of my menu. I dumped lots of weight after taking it out!

We are low on food right now, so I had a serving yesterday and I felt awful, like I ate a couple jelly donuts. I am wondering if I cannot tolerate a total carb count that high at one serving, even if the "net carb" count is low.

Another crazy experiment: I have been keeping my calories fairly low (primarily because I recently dumped 12 lbs and don't won't to overeat), and decided to have about 2 cups broccoli with butter at one meal and nothing else to see if I might have a problem with eating a lot of high fiber/low carb food. I felt really stuffed for a long time!

I am not a person who just recently introduced high fiber foods into her diet either, so I am fairly perplexed.

Anyone else wondering about net carbs?

[selfxuntitled]

Re: Not really convinced about net carbs...

Ok, this is something I have wanted to discuss with everyone. I am not exactly convinced that we can always discount the fiber carbs in certain foods. My case in point: Low carb hot cereal. This is the CarbSense Mini-Carb stuff that has these ingredients: soy protein concentrate, wheat bran, flax seed meal, pumpkin seed flour, spices, salt.

Well, it says that in one serving, there are 15g carbs with 12 g fiber, for a 3 net carb total. Now as net carbs go, this is a good choice for those of us in the grain rung of OWL. However, when I did an experiment and ate one serving about 3 times per week (changed nothing else) I stalled out like crazy. I did this for about 3 weeks (to give it a chance), then decided to take it out of my menu. I dumped lots of weight after taking it out!

We are low on food right now, so I had a serving yesterday and I felt awful, like I ate a couple jelly donuts. I am wondering if I cannot tolerate a total carb count that high at one serving, even if the "net carb" count is low.

Another crazy experiment: I have been keeping my calories fairly low (primarily because I recently dumped 12 lbs and don't won't to overeat), and decided to have about 2 cups broccoli with butter at one meal and nothing else to see if I might have a problem with eating a lot of high fiber/low carb food. I felt really stuffed for a long time!

I am not a person who just recently introduced high fiber foods into her diet either, so I am fairly perplexed.

Anyone else wondering about net carbs?

thats why i eat fresh... i mean... the net carb thing just confuses me

[borntolose]

:wave I am a diabetic total carbs show up on my blood glucose monitor. BGM doesn't take off the fiber. Eating fiber doesn't change my BGs.
BJ Webb

[G-Mom]

:wave I am a diabetic total carbs show up on my blood glucose monitor. BGM doesn't take off the fiber. Eating fiber doesn't change my BGs.
BJ Webb

Have you ever tried eating a bowl of high carb, yet high fiber cereal then check your BG to see if it spikes? That would be interesting...

[sadie147]

I usually do my carb counts without doing net carbs just to be safe. I'm the same as you ...usually pretty skeptical about them.

[borntolose]

:wave Yes! It does cause my BG to spike. My doctor told me to always eat protein, carbs, and fiber together to keep my BG from spiking. In my experiment to live with my disease I have found out that cereal can be the biggest problem with BG spikes.

I have an arsenal of Almond Flour, Atkins Baking Mix, Flax Meal, wheat germ, and Soy protein. I can bake or pan bake some interesting and tasty bread type foods. For a hamburger I use a Wasa Crispbread. ( I buy these at my local grocery.) http://www.germandeli.com/wasacrispbread.html

I also found out that I don't want or need baked or bread stuff very often and baking walnuts in their shells and eating them warm makes me feel like I ate fresh baked bread.
BJ

[Effie]

As a lifelong weight watchers members, I'm wondering if we can take a page from their book regarding the fiber. A few years ago, they changed the way they counted the points value of certain foods by saying that you can only count the first 4 grams of fiber. The reasoning was something like your body will only recognize about 4 grams of fiber, but the rest of it will still be metabolized by the body. I don't know how true this is, but I think the real reason they did this is because people were eating high fiber foods, like chili with beans, in huge amounts because the point values were still low. Maybe if we only deduct the first 4g of fiber from a certain food to find our "net carbs", we'd be better off. It won't be scientifically accurate, but might be a good rule to thumb to use.

[G-Mom]

I hope 2big or not2late swoops in here with some science, but if the cereal spikes blood glucose, wouldn't that mean the cereal (even with all that fiber) caused a surge of insulin? Wouldn't that mean that there is a higher possibility that those carbs will be stored as fat, especially if we are counting only "3 net carbs" when the body actually treats the amount as 15?

[borntolose]

This is what Joslin Diabetes Center says - How Does Fiber Affect Blood Glucose Levels? http://www.joslin.org/education/libr...oodsugar.shtml
BJ Webb

[G-Mom]

Thanks for that link, borntolose, it sparked another question for me!

[not2late]

I was perplexed about the fiber thing too. In my research, I found that back in the 1940s and 1950s they did studies that showed fiber slows down the digestion of sugars. This was good news to diabetics because before insulin was widely available the diabetic diet was a ketogenic diet (low carb).

So that's what the net carb thing is based on, in part, imo. However, the Atkins diet didn't start doing the "net carb" thing until the 2002 version of the doet. I think in the 2000 and 2001 editions of the 1992 diet, they were counting "net carbs", but prior to that, Atkins counted total carbs.

I really think it depends what you eat your grains with in order to diminish the glucose response. The glycemic index everyone talks about is based on the glucose response to a food. BUT, the glycemic index of any food can be lowered with the addition of fat. That's why a Mars Bar has a lower glycemic index than a plain baked potato---the Mars bar contains fat. So I think if you eat your low carb tortilla with fat (mayo, butter, cheese), the fat combined with the fiber in the food will decrease your insulin response.

Personally, I don't trust the processed foods where more than half the carbs are from fiber....

[MontanaRebel]

One thing we have to remember which is very important is the make-up of everyone's body is different and so the way Atkins does it may not bother some people.

It is good you found out how it reacts to you!

I am a diabetic as well and since I have been on the Induction phase since Monday my sugars are more stable than they have been in a long time. ha

[borntolose]

:wave In an actual test as of today:

1/2 cup Fiber One Bran Cereal 14 net grams (25 grams total) fiber
O grams of Sugar

Results of Type II off meds since June - July 1993

Fasting 91
1 hour 101
2 hours 98

BJ Webb

[G-Mom]

So, this means the cereal raised your BG level after eating it, but not much.

I am wondering if I am sensitive because I was pre-diabetic before Atkins (I would have hypoglycemic attacks about 3 times per week where I had to eat something or I felt like I would pass out). Post-Atkins, I never had one attack.

[borntolose]

The best way to find out how you respond to food is to invest in a BG meter. The four most important times to test are the 12 hour fast, the overnight fast 8-9 hours, 1 hour after a meal and 2 hours after a meal and write down the results. In addition, you need an A1C test that shows your "average" glucose control over the previous 2 to 3 months. You can do a A1C test at home. The monitor you need can be purchased on-line or at a pharmacy.

The response I had this morning was normal because it was down at the 2-hour reading.

This line has a good FAQ http://www.diabetesandhealth.com/pub...enter/faqs.htm

BJ Webb