Chocoholic serial failer

[Helena-in-England]

Re: Chocoholic serial failer

I bet you all thought that you would never hear from me again, didn't you?

Well four days after my last posting, I gave up chocolate.

Cold turkey.

No frankenfoods. No feeding the addiction. No perpetuating the addiction. No pandering to the addiction. Zero chocolate from 16th August. Damn it was hard.

I then spent two days thinking about what it is that always makes me fall off the induction wagon.

The difference between me and many others is that I am severely insulin resistant, I am also extremely sugar- and carb-sensitive.

People on here accept that one bite of some sweet pastry or something like that sets off sugar cravings. Well my tolerance level is clearly much lower. Salads seems to lead to disaster for me.

I also thought and read what Atkins said about severely insulin resistant people like me. Fat fast.

So on 19th August I began my Big Experiment: less than 5% carbs a day. A fat fast, in fact.

At first it appeared that it was going to be the hardest thing I ever did. SO much stricter than Atkins! How could I possibly keep to it?

Turned out, to my amazement, it was the easiest thing I ever did!

Once I gave up all the salad and veggies, all the cravings disappeared. What is more:

1. carpal tunnel syndrome - disappeared. Surgery cancelled
2. Oedema in feet - disappeared. Can now wear shoes too tight five weeks ago.
3. Sleep apnoea - disappeared
4. Skin tags shrunk and no longer irritating
5. Very little hunger, can now go 16 hours without food before I get hungry
6. Feel 100% in control of my eating
7. I eat for fuel not for entertainment
8. No more indigestion
9. I don't WANT to eat anything but meat
10. No shopping, hence less temptation (butcher delivers)

I cannot tell you how happy and proud I am that I gave up chocolate. I honestly feel as though I have got out of a PRISON.

I've been eating sirloin steak just about every day for over a month. I love them! For variety I have had fatty pork, lamb, the odd omelet, though the cheese and egg combination made me feel sick all day, unfortunately.

I've been eating 6oz to 8oz of meat at each meal, and plenty of fat. I even put butter on my steak. I sip double cream (it tastes sweet now) for a treat.

On Fitday my stats have been 75% fat and 20% protein and less than 5% carbs.

I have been using Ketostix and am in ketosis for the very first time in my life! I NEVER got into ketosis while on Induction.

At the end of the month I weighed and measured, and to my absolute horror I have lost NOTHING. Not weight and not inches.

This is severe metabolic disorder indeed!

I am still reeling from that shocking news.

So on Wednesday I started adding a LITTLE bit of carb back into my diet, but I am being very cautious.

I bought hummus, lettuce, mushrooms and fine green beans and added a bit to my protein meals. So far I am still in ketosis but I am extremely cautious about increasing the veggies to the point of falling OUT of ketosis.

(I am not sure why, since being in ketosis has not led to any weight loss.)

I have been doing a workout and lengths at the pool one hour every other day throughout. I now plan to use weights at my desk a couple of times a day to see if that helps.

I must admit that, after a month of being on a high, I am again plunged into despair --

-- will my body NEVER give up its fat stores?

-- why have I lost nothing despite being in ketosis?

-- am I welcome on here if it turns out that I need to eat fewer than 20g carbs long term, or will I be rejected because my body doesn't respond to induction?

[Georgiana]

Re: Chocoholic serial failer

First of all, kudos for being chocolate-free for so long. That's an amazing accomplishment! And even with no weight loss, the fact that your health improved is an excellent result.

-- will my body NEVER give up its fat stores?

-- why have I lost nothing despite being in ketosis?

Could you post a few menus, including quantities for all foods and drinks?

Are you taking any medication/supplements?

-- am I welcome on here if it turns out that I need to eat fewer than 20g carbs long term, or will I be rejected because my body doesn't respond to induction?

Of course you are welcome here even if you need to eat fewer than 20 net carbs.

You mentioned hummus. I would not introduce that just yet. Chickpeas only come in OWL Rung 6, and although hummus is low in carbs, it is not Induction-friendly.

Also, although I have a feeling you already know this, just because the stix don't change color, it does not necessarily mean you are not in lipolysis/ketosis. So, if the stix stop changing color when you eat veggies, it's fine as long as you still have the physical signs of ketosis. If eating veggies causes you cravings, my guess is that is likely not veggies in general that are the problem, but only certain vegetables and food combinations. Maybe you can notice some patters if you go through your food journal.

[HoosierDaddy]

Re: Chocoholic serial failer

One question: are you drinking your water? If not, you may not be flushing out your system enough.

Hang in there, you seem like you are on the right track, trying to find out what works for your body and metabolic rates. I fell slightly off track for about five days -- not overly much, but I did fall -- and I'm back on now. So, I know what that's like.

Just keep on keepin on. It should start happening.

[chauber]

Re: Chocoholic serial failer

So this is totally off Atkins, but if it can help you succeed...there are many studies that have determined that the drug Zonegran (Zonisamide)...which is an anti-seisure medicine...can be helpful for these types of addictions. It is considered an off-label use and is dosed lower than for seizure treatment. It is supposed to severly or completely elliminate uncontrollable cravings for sweets. Maybe you could ask you doctor about taking it for six months or so and see if you can break the chocolate addiction. Let's face it..many people are not able to quit other addictions cold turkey...and the experiements that I have seen are best when combined with a low carb lifestyle.

For everyone else...please do not yell at me for giving off-plan advice...in this case it really may be life or death.

Good luck.

PS...oops didn't read all of the thread before I realized that she was able to do it...but for someone else this may work.

[RitaCeleste]

Re: Chocoholic serial failer

Getting your body to go into ketosis is just the first step. You can loose fat yet hold water for weeks as your body is keeping those fat cells ready to put fat back in them. Finally in a week or up to a month, your body will give up on getting the fat back and rid itself of the water. My dad went on and off of Atkins a lot. Now he will loose nothing on the scales, then suddenly drop up to ten pounds a month later. It can be very demoralizing to not see the scales move for so long. Also you do not always show ketones on the strip. That could just mean you used up all that fat and there was not enough left to turn the strip. Like after excercise. If your calories are not too high and your carbs are not to high, you are burning your fat! Keep track of what you should have lost based on calories and compare it to the whooshes you will have when you loose the water weight. Now that your body has discovered the way to burn fat, you may be able to eat a little more veggies without dropping back out of it. At first I did the fat fast cause I could never get the strips to turn. Then I found they turned on induction food, but only at certain times of the day. I can hold water in the place of fat for a week or two before I whoose it out. You are going to have to rely on the strips and maybe fitday to guess how much fat you are loosing if you turn out to be a water holder. This can become less as your body gets use to giving up the fat.

[Helena-in-England]

Re: Chocoholic serial failer

Thanks everyone for dropping by.

Wow Rita you've lost 85lb that is just a dream for me!

Will my dreams come true?

[DarlingBri]

Re: Chocoholic serial failer

LastChance, I am SO HAPPY to see you here! I'm DELIGHTED for you that you broke your choc addiction. You are a super star

I think the most important thing you've done in the last month is taken control of your eating. Weight loss is secondary to that, because if you don't have control, you're not going to be able to do it. You do have control, and you will lose weight.

I'm sure anyone here would be happy to do whatever is possible to help you get the pounds going. Like Georgiana says, if you can post a menu for a day or two, maybe we can help you there. If you're using FitDay, that makes it easy to look at your whole diet.

5. Very little hunger, can now go 16 hours without food before I get hungry

Stuff like reminding you that you MUST eat at least every 6 hours may be the little reminders you need to adjust your plan and make progress with a clean induction. It's possible you might not be losing weight because you're not eating either enough, or often enough, for example, or that you're introducing foods prematurely.

[RitaCeleste]

Re: Chocoholic serial failer

I thought I had serious metabolic disorder at first. Turns out I am a water holder, and over time my body has gotten better about going into ketosis. The most annoying things I deal with is if I go over my carb limit of 20 to 30 carbs a day, I can gain a pound or two of water. A carby weekend of cheating will show up as 10 pounds of water that will sit there for a week. Even though I am smaller now, I still drop about 8 to 10 pounds of water on induction. Then I don't loose another thing for two weeks, then Whoosh it comes off in two days. Now that I have been on it for awhile, I get a little whoosh of a pound or two every six or seven days. But the water holding makes it harder to judge how to move the rungs and when I am still loosing. I tried going up the rungs and keeping my carbs low, I thought I would stall and I dropped a pound anyway a few days later. I was thinking I couldn't possibly eat that and loose weight, but it was just water. Although I have to keep my daily carbs low, I find I want to work more foods in if I can. The best way to judge if I can eat something is how it affects my cravings for other things. When I first started Atkins I was a serial cheater. A bad one, a chinese buffet one! Now my cheats are more like a peice of fruit or a spoonful of peanut butter. The things that use to keep me up at night, just don't anymore. And my body is not the same machine it was when I started. A peice of fruit use to stall me two years ago, now it doesn't. So there is hope. And don't be afraid to retry something later on if it doesn't work at first. Sometimes its trying it a different way. Everyone's body is different and finding what works for yours is going to be an ongoing process. But as long as you are willing to keep trying, it will pay off.

[Helena-in-England]

Re: Chocoholic serial failer

Thanks to EVERYONE for dropping by.

I can see the problem that is going to rear its head. I'm not going to be following Atkins with regards to the water and going up the rungs. I'm just going to be v v v v lc. Up to 20g carb.

So I don't think I am going to be able to keep my journal on here.

I had a journal on the ZOIH board (zero carbs) but they bullied me and insulted me so much that I left, in tears.

The "reason" for their bullying was that I go to the swimming pool and do a bit of stretching and kicking and a few lengths for an hour every other day. A dozen of them came down on me like a ton of bricks screaming at me every day to STOP doing ANY form of exercise. They said that swimming makes you fatter. Even the board owner Charles Washington (himself a runner) chimed in, agreeing with them all.

Their objection was that swimming makes you hungrier, thus you eat more.

But swimming does NOT make me eat more. If anything, it suppresses my appetite.

When I told them this, they insulted me. I am "in denial". I am "deluding myself", they know me better than I know myself. I don't understand the science, etc etc.

I did make it clear I was never going to give up swimming, and all listed the reasons I go (cardio workout, stretching, good for lungs, good for muscle tone, lifts my mood, no impact on my joints etc)

Then someone started going on about my "subconscious". Yes she had the nerve to try to amateur-psychoanalyse me, though she had no qualifications to do so and had never met me. She said the more I try to invent "justifications" for swimming, the more she was convinced that I should not go swimming.

In the end I could take no more and I left.

They are extremely zealous and will not tolerate anyone who does not do exactly as they are told.

And yet they are hypocrites because when I visited their blogs they are still drinking coffee and using artificial sweeteners! I did not criticise them. They know its against the rules.

I demand the right to choose my own choices.

I am happy for people to make suggestions based on evidence but I am a 51 year old graduate not a 5 year old and won't be bullied.

So I abandoned my Journal on the zc board and looked for somewhere else.

I looked at lowcarb friends but was put off because about 75% of the postings are non-diet chit chat. On the gallery people even post pics of their dogs. Well that is fantastic for people who need a socialising forum. I just want somewhere I can keep a journal of my progress and most of all to meet people who have lost 86lb!

I'm not going up the rungs because the rungs are the reason I have failed on Atkins time and time again over 9 years. Carbs cause me to have cravings. Almost all carbs, apart from maybe mushrooms, cream, French beans, lettuce and hummus. I am not sure about sprouts, they might be OK (winter food, have not tried them yet).

Rita you say you are not on Atkins at all. And yet you have lost 86lb. I met women on the zero carb board who have lost that much as well, without drinking vast amounts of water as with Atkins. And without doing exercise (their choice)

So, what will happen if I keep a journal on here? People will keep flying in and criticising me all the time for not going up the rungs, for not eating frequently enough, for not drinking enough water. All because they think I ought to be following Atkins when I am not.

I know this is an Atkins forum, how do you cope Rita, if you are not follwing Atkins and yet you are on an atkins board and you say you are on Rung 7?

[DarlingBri]

Re: Chocoholic serial failer

Last Chance, nobody here is going to bully you. We also appear to have a surprisingly limited number of totally insane people, and nobody is going to tell you that you should not swim! (That is the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard in my life.) We may give you applause, congratulations and kudos but nobody is going to tell you that's a bad thing. Sheesh.

Don't worry about the rungs yet. Just... make sure you're taking your multi vit stop thinking about them. Cross that bridge when you come to it, and make decisions with help from supportive, experienced people who have been successful in similar situations. Get your eating, menus and weight loss under control and go from there. For people with a lot of weight to lose, Atkins suggest adding carbohydrate very slowly and spending weeks at each new 5 gram level. You have time and nobody here is going anywhere.

Don't look at the water as an insurmountable obstacle. Eight 8oz glasses of water sounded like a lot to me too and I have spent 15 years complaining I don't like water. I got a pint glass and it's a little easier to drink those, but what really works for me is the squeezey bottles. I don't know why - maybe I don't like gulping?

It's a very diuretic diet. You need to replace water and you need it to loose weight:

"Water also is vital for chemical reactions in digestion and metabolism... If people who are trying to lose weight don't drink enough water, the body can't metabolize the fat adequately." [source]

So yes, this is key and there just isn't a way to tell you it isn't. It's not an Atkins thing or a Zealot thing - it's just what everyone (even people not dieting and not on Atkins) need to provide their body. Maybe if you tell us what your issue with water is, we'll be able to help you with a plan. There are a lot of ways to do it if you make it your next challenge... chewing ice chips, maybe? Soda water? Sparkling mineral water? Seltzer?

[Helena-in-England]

Re: Chocoholic serial failer

THANK you for your message.

"nobody here is going to bully you."

I will call you in if they try, my Big Sister in Ireland! I do actually have an older sister she lives in Shannon Co Clare.

"Get your eating, menus and weight loss under control"

2 out of 3 done! I am really happy with my eating, unhappy at lack of weight loss.

"Atkins suggest adding carbohydrate very slowly and spending weeks at each new 5 gram level."

OK. I am now on 5g and I don't want to go up the rungs at all. From what I have read it's unecessary to eat carbs.

"Eight 8oz glasses of water sounded like a lot to me too".

I have a pint glass on my desk at all times and a 750ml sports bottle by my bed. I reckon I drink about 3 to 5 pints of water a day. But I don't pee much out, never have.

"Maybe if you tell us what your issue with water is, we'll be able to help you with a plan."

I did have a problem last time I tried Atkins: drinking more than my body wants, I get bloated with it and with my huge stomach pressing on my bladder I had a few accidents - i.e. I lost control and wet myself. Naturally as a professional woman I cannot possibly risk that happening in a public situation. If I drink to my thirst, it never happens.

"Soda water? Sparkling mineral water? Seltzer?"

I have a habit that I am into: I fill half my pint glass with boiling water, and then fill it to the top with fizzy water. Sometimes add a dash of lemon for a hot fizzy lemonade. Mostly without lemon. I do half and half because fizzy water is too fizzy to drink too much of (make me burp!) and plain water too boring.

[DarlingBri]

Re: Chocoholic serial failer

OK, you can un-man the panic station because you are actually in MUCH better shape than you thought you were. 4 pints = exactly 64oz of water. You are already doing it! There's no need to drink any more if it's causing you any issues at all.

You can call on me whenever you need to but I really don't think it's going to be an issue

You need to re-study the Atkins rungs. Induction allows up to 20 grams of carbs a day. I know you don't want to eat that but just so you know: if you added 5 carbs tomorrow, you would not be "climbing a rung." Climbing rungs is about adding new foods; you can still add new foods within your 20 carb limit if you are indeed one of those people who can only lose on very low carbs.

I don't know that you are, though. Did you know that people only lose in a range? You could be one of those 20 - 30 g a day people! You don't know if you are never willing to add carbs.

2 cups of lettuce (3 carbs) plus 1 cup of green beans (4 net carbs) is 7 carbs. What are you eating if you're only getting 5 grams a day?

The whole Atkins plan is a slow change over to a way of eating for life. While you could stay at 20 carbs a day, you cannot stay on an Induction menu for life. You must eventually have some fruit in your diet, for example, and you're going to need some vegetable variety for well-rounded vitamins and minerals.

[Helena-in-England]

Re: Chocoholic serial failer

I really hate the title of this thread. I am going to start a new one and abandon this thread. It depresses me to read it.

Bye see you on the new thread!

[mizski]

Re: Chocoholic serial failer

That is the silliest thing I've ever heard about the swimming. I do remember years ago being told that I would never lose weight by swimming as you had to run or do things that made you hot and sweaty and that swimming was a waste of time. Geez, what's up with these diet/exercise zealots?

Swimming is wonderful. For heavy people, it is a very good low impact workout. The resistance of the water does provide a good muscle/cardio workout with no impact on the bones. Much more important (to me anyways) is that swimming is good for your mind and soul...it is so peaceful being in the water and for very heavy people it is one of the few times that we can move about gracefully like a fish gliding through the water. OK, so maybe we're round fishes but they are graceful in the water too.

I would keep your journal on here if you want to. There is the stats one where no one can comment as well as the chats version where people can give you feedback. And remember that feedback is just that and a lot of times comments are generalized to take into account newbies reading that may not be following ANY plan. You are working on discovering what will work for YOU. And that's what it is all about. And if very low carb is your springboard to better health, so be it.

See you on your new thread.

[Helena-in-England]

Re: Chocoholic serial failer

Thanks Mizski and see you on the new thread.

THIS THREAD IS NOW CLOSED.