I know I know cals are not counted...BUT! I got a question

[Jellybean1984]

I am 277 hehe and is there a min calorie intake i should have so i am not starving myself i try to eat into the thousands but usually just add stuff to my food to make it there. if i had my way(my full apitite) id eat 800 not watching but in fitday when it all totals its in around here.
Is this unhealthy considering my weight? if so then well ill just add more cals to stuff if not then im not adding stuff i dont feel like. lol (IE, butter)
and i know we dont follow them i am just concerned maybe i am too low.

[cleochatra]

Re: I know I know cals are not counted...BUT! I got a question

There is no minimal caloric intake so long as you are feeding your hunger/body and not feeling badly/weak, etc. My doctor told me starvation mode doesn't exist for we larger beauties and that people who have had weight loss surgery eat between 600-900 calories a day and that this is fab for people with weight to lose. The difference between us and weight loss surgery patients is that we didn't require the surgery to lose the weight.

Do not arbitrarily add carbs to assuage some minimal bmr numbers at this stage of the game. If your body isn't asking for it, you are only going to be feeding your fat cells and the notion that you're supposed to eat when not hungry.

In other words, you're doing great!

[Perry]

Re: I know I know cals are not counted...BUT! I got a question

And remember to eat 'something' every 5-6 hours according to DANDR.

[cleochatra]

Re: I know I know cals are not counted...BUT! I got a question

LOL... even if not hungry? If the book tells you to eat to non-hunger and learn your body signals, and it then tells you to eat every 6 hours, hungry or no, there's a bit of a discrepancy there. It's weird. But then, Modified OWL isn't in the book either and it works well for others.

[Jellybean1984]

Re: I know I know cals are not counted...BUT! I got a question

i know that confuses me cause if i ate when i was hunfry id eat a salad and be done with it, i eat to live now not live to eat but then it says eat every 5-6 waking hours lol oh well thanks!!! I just didnt wanna hurt me.

[cypressgirl]

Re: I know I know cals are not counted...BUT! I got a question

I try to remember to eat even when I am not hungry so that it doesn't sneak up on me and then I find myself REALLY hungry. Just a little something you know? Like a deviled egg or something. When I wasn't doing that I would find it really hard to feel full with a regular (for me) amount of food - I think I would actually eat a little more just all at one time & that, of course, can lead to blood sugar spikes, cravings, yadda yadda....Seems to work very well for me!Seems like you are doing fine. Just allow your "Atkins Instincts" to develop and guide you!

[cleochatra]

Re: I know I know cals are not counted...BUT! I got a question

cypress rocks em socks em robots. It can be a small, very small snack. I think the key is to not eat when not hungry but you want to ensure you don't starve... so if you believe eating every 6 hours is necessity, you can always adjust by eating 6 smaller meals per day, or 6 maxi snacks per day, as opposed to trying to unceremoniously eat simply because it's 6 hours later. At your caloric level, you're looking at 150 calories per maxi-snack/mini meal (or more depending on your actual hunger).

[not2late]

Re: I know I know cals are not counted...BUT! I got a question

The 6 hour rule is to done in order to stabilize your blood glucose--let it dip too much and for too long you can develop the blood sugar instability issues (see Chapter 12 for the Blood Sugar Instability Test for other symptoms of it). Dr. Atkins said to eat a small snack---he didn't say eat a 14 course meal. So a small snack can be something like a single devilled egg or something like Dr. Atkins suggested in Chapter 11: a slice of pot roast. Again, it's to stabilize your blood sugars.

The trick is to not get sucked into the gorging habit or the inadvertent gorging habit. So pay attention to your serving sizes. If you aren't certain of what a proper Atkins serving size is, look at the recipes in the back of DANDR 2002. A serving of meat is about 3-7 cooked ounces. A serving of added fat is 1 teaspoon to 2 tablespoons. So washing down that hardboiled egg with 1/4 cup of mayonnaise isn't what Dr. Atkins had in mind in terms of portions.

As for the validity of Modified OWL, it's not in the book at least in the form folks here do it. If you are one of those people with a high metabolic resistance to weight loss and have a CCLL of 15-20, you aren't doomed to spend the rest of your Atkins weight loss languishing in Induction. You can move up the ladder. Dr. Atkins understood that Induction isn't the most nutritionally complete phase of his diet and knew that the introduction of OWL foods did balance this diet nutritionally--otherwise, the diet would have consisted of Induction and Maintenance. So for those very few people, it's okay to move up the OWL carb ladder, while staying within their CCLL because their CCLL is 15-20 net carbs daily. But for the rest of us, the majority of us who have medium to low metabolic resistance....nope.

Similarily extended Induction isn't in the book either, at least in the way folks around here do it. Many people over look the little sentence in Chapter 12 that says you can stay on Induction until your metabolic resistance issues are resolved. Again, there are people here who are not metabolically resistant to weight loss according to the charts in the book. Yet they stick around Induction regardless of their metabolic status hoping they'll lose the weight "fast". The book doesn't say to stay on Induction until you are half-way to your weight loss goal, or are 20 pounds from your weight loss goal, or are 15 pounds from your goal. According to the stats Dr. Atkins briefly mentioned in the book, this forum should be populated by less than 10% of ADBBers.

[Bren]

Re: I know I know cals are not counted...BUT! I got a question

Just something I think needs mentioning. I am working with several woman who have had weight loss surgury. Until they are able to get their calories up to a certain level most doctors will not let them even begin an exercise program. They are also on an amazing amount of vitamins...... many taken through injection.

[cleochatra]

Re: I know I know cals are not counted...BUT! I got a question

We agree, Megs! I think that servings matter. It's all controlled in the end whether you call it a serving of fat versus a serving of fat. I knew we always did agree on this matter. The only difference is in the language.

As an aside, I do have concerns about touting those things which are not in the book.

Ratios not in the book. Extended induction per se not in the book. Modified OWL not in the book. Calories mentioned but smacked down... People eating frankenfoods for a day and applauded when it's not in the book.

Some complain people confuse people here, but what's more confusing? Telling people to do what's in the book when there's plenty that's not?

It's all so incredibly odd and confusing.

I think it would be better to admit we're really not a by the book board. Or a by the book plus board... or minus. A little honesty goes a long way rather than the constant attempted justifications of what is actually in the book or not.

Either we should agree that things not in the book are fair game to discuss, or they're not. But I'm seeing some contradictory things that, to me, seem... well... unseemly.

We're all doing Atkins here, and we all use the 2002 version of DANDR. In the end, what ends up being added to the text is either worth discussing or not. But who makes those determinations in the end when we're all so incredibly different?

To tie this full-circle, Jenler has to do what is right for her. We can guide her, give her advice, try to justify why what we tell her should happen even if it's not in the book due to scientific evidence, etc.

In the end, the important thing is that we're here for each other, we all follow Atkins and we are honest with what is in the book and what we've improved upon (as I see it as an improvement) at ADBB.

I think there's a lot to feel blessed with. {{{Jenler}}}{{{Megs}}}

[cleochatra]

Re: I know I know cals are not counted...BUT! I got a question

Bren-- Having known a few WLS patients myself, the ones I know can exercise and they bring in the same low amount of calories, dietarily. they were only not allowed to exercise due to post-op issues. The vitamins are due to their inability to process foods for nutrients as we can due to the surgery and not due to limited caloric intake.

[Bren]

Re: I know I know cals are not counted...BUT! I got a question

I called The Atkins Center along with alot of others, when Dr. Atkins was still alive and they had staff to answer questions. We learned about the percentages etc. from them directly.

[Bren]

Re: I know I know cals are not counted...BUT! I got a question

The girls I am working with at Curves, all had to have their doctors approval and a release to begin exercising, once they reach a certain calorie intake.

[Bren]

Re: I know I know cals are not counted...BUT! I got a question

OPPS ........Jenler, please accept my apologies. I did not mean to hijack your thread and go off topic!

[cleochatra]

Re: I know I know cals are not counted...BUT! I got a question

I'm sorry, too, Jenler!

Bren, I appreciate what you're saying. But really. Atkins nutritionals? And we believe them why?! Did you see what a member here did in the main forum eating a bunch o their junk in an experiment that was to some degree lauded for it's value?

It's not in the book. I think we just need to be honest and say, "Look. We don't do everything by the book here"... I don't mind that we don't. Seriously. But when people discuss something not in the book (or perceived as being not in the book...as this thread might be perceived as being wrong because it's not in the book in a forum of extended induction which is also a questionable forum), we have to get real. We have to be real. We have to be willing to say, "No, this isn't in the book, so take it for what you will" instead of preaching it as though it's in the book.

Another example: Boot Camp. Touted as "by the book"... it's not. It's false advertising and also the reason why people DS' get their butts chewed when recruits say, "the ratios ain't in the book"... well they ain't. *lol*

I know the ultimate good of the board is to educate. So why do we obfuscate? I can handle being told calories don't matter... but if they don't, neither do ratios and the other things that work for people that are just extra tools.

Bren-- that's more of a CYA so that Curves doesn't get sued. I don't blame your business, either. I wouldn't want to get sued either because someone's pancreas fell out during a circuit. *LOL*... OTOH, that would definitely curb the lunchtime hungries!