Please Advise: Mainly Fat Vs Mainly Protein

[Lyssie]

Re: Please Advise: Mainly Fat Vs Mainly Protein

Ohmygod. You're supposed to be getting your vitamins, minerals, and fiber from the foods that you eat. Supplements are just that - to supplement, not to take the place of. The people on this board follow the advice of the 2002 DANDR which has the most up-to-date information. People (including me) have lost more when incorporating more foods and more carbs. Dr. Atkins *DID* give a minimum daily requirement for veggies in the 2002 edition. I don't think *VEGETABLES* were the cause of obesity, or what the AMA is using as their base in the pyramid.

[ValidRouge]

Re: Please Advise: Mainly Fat Vs Mainly Protein

Yes, this board advises based on the Dr. Atkins New Diet Revolution copyright 2002, not the 1992 version.

3 cups of vegetables 2 of which are considered "salad" vegetables--PLEASE make sure you eat your vegetables!
Vegetables
You can have two to three cups per day of:

alfalfa sprouts
daikon
mushrooms
arugula
endive
parsley
bok choy
escarole
peppers
celery
fennel
radicchio
chicory
jicama
radishes
chives
lettuce
romaine lettuce
cucumber
moche
sorrel
These salad vegetables are high in phytonutrients and provide a good source of fiber.

Other Vegetables
You can have one cup per day of these veggies if salad does not exceed two cups. The following vegetables are slightly higher in carbohydrate content than the salad vegetables:

artichoke
celery root
pumpkin
artichoke hearts
rhubarb
asparagus
chard
sauerkraut
bamboo shoots
collard greens
scallions
dandelion
snow peas
bean sprouts
dandelion greens
spaghetti squash
beet greens
eggplant
spinach
broccoli
hearts of palm
string or wax beans
broccoli rabe
kale
summer squash
brussels
kohlrabi
tomato
bean sprouts
leeks
turnips
cabbage
okra
water chestnuts
cauliflower
onion
zucchini
If a vegetable, such as spinach or tomato, cooks down significantly, it must be measured raw so as not to underestimate its carb count.

[not2late]

Re: Please Advise: Mainly Fat Vs Mainly Protein

Just a comment about the Inuits and their diet of seal and bear meat. Yeah, they eat organ meat, like liver, pancreas, brain, etc. because those meats have a high concentration of vitamins and minerals. And they also eat them raw: cooking denatures/inactivates some vitamins and enzymes. But, I don't know how many people outside of the traditional Inuit community would eat organ meat, particularly raw organ meat. And I don't know if the Inuits would have restricted their traditional diet to animal sources if they had access to vegetables and fruits, like other native tribes had in their regions: the Native American tribes elsewhere certainly ate and preserved for winter use the vegetables, grains and fruits indigenous to their lands.

Anyway, there were a number of changes between the 1992 Atkins Diet and the 2002 Diet. For one, the 1992 diet counted total carbs, not net carbs. The amount of vegetables was different. If I recall correctly, the "other vegetable list" was limited to 2/3 cup. In 2002 it was increased to 1 cup. Also the 2002 Diet stipulates that at least half of your daily carb intake must be from vegetables. And the On-Going Weight Loss and Pre-Maintenance Phases are more thoroughly explained in the 2002 book.

The problems with the Food Pyramid is that they put a huge emphasis on grains and cereals, rather than on low glycemic vegetables and fruits. It took them 10 years to begin advocating whole grain products and avoiding trans fats/hydrogenated or partially hydrogenated oils. And they advocated removing all fats/oils including natural oils from foods like olives and nuts.

[genekh]

Re: Please Advise: Mainly Fat Vs Mainly Protein

I've trying to combine all your advice into a menu I can follow, so today's menu was as follows:
Breakfast: Tesco's tuna crunch sandwich filler (tuna, peppers, mayo)

Brunch: King prawns

Lunch: Tesco's chicken caesar sandwich filler (chicken, tomatoes, cucumbers, caesar dressing)

Dinner: Brussels pate + 175g broccoli

Total calories: 2180, fat/protein/carbs 70/27/3, net carbs 19.2g

Water 4L, fiber (psyllium husks) 18g

Does this sound reasonale - not too much veggies?

If this goes well I will alternate chicken caesar with egg+mayo or egg+mayo+bacon; pate with creme fraiche + some protein; broccoli with spinach

[Lyssie]

Re: Please Advise: Mainly Fat Vs Mainly Protein

That looks really good... You added the net carbs from the psyllium into the total net carbs for the day, right??

[genekh]

Re: Please Advise: Mainly Fat Vs Mainly Protein

Actually it's not all psyllium husks - the label says it fructo-oligo-saccharides with probiotics and psylium husks powder - basically it says it's not digestible so lists 0 cals, 0 carbs - 0 everything... I don't think I should count those

[sadie147]

Re: Please Advise: Mainly Fat Vs Mainly Protein

Actually it's not all psyllium husks - the label says it fructo-oligo-saccharides with probiotics and psylium husks powder - basically it says it's not digestible so lists 0 cals, 0 carbs - 0 everything... I don't think I should count those

I take psyllium husks (not in a pill form) as well and you are righ they are 0 net carbs on their own..not sure about what elese might be in them? maybe count them as 1 to be safe.

[Lyssie]

Re: Please Advise: Mainly Fat Vs Mainly Protein

Sorry, I don't use them, I've only ever done flax... I was just checkin!

[genekh]

Re: Please Advise: Mainly Fat Vs Mainly Protein

Hello, everyone.

I really appreciate your comments to my post.

I followed your advice and changed my daily menu to something like this

Total calories: ~2200, fat/protein/carbs 67/30/3, net carbs ~18g - I am basically eating around my BMR; water 4L, fiber (psyllium husks) 18g


You see, when I just switched to this last Sat/Sun I had to make myself eat it all and by Mon night my body composition monitor was showing that I lost almost 1kg of fat with no muscle mass lost. Once I started exercising on Monday I started feeling hungry during the day and in the evening even with all this food and I am mainly losing water now - fat is back to what it was last Friday.

Do you think I could be undereating on weekdays when I exercise - maybe I should top it up with some more fat? If so - by how much would you suggest?

To add - I've been down with a flu since Thursday, so I didn't do any exercise. I've been eating the same daily menu, and gained my water back, but I am by now out of ketosis (ketostix negative), and my body composition monitor is showing that I am gaining fat again- not sure what I am doing wrong. Could it be that I'am eating too much protein?

Any advice will be appreciated.


Thanks again for your help

Yevgen

[ValidRouge]

Re: Please Advise: Mainly Fat Vs Mainly Protein

First of all, those scales aren't even close to accurate. The can give you a general guideline of your body composition over a long period of time. But for day to day fluctuations, all you are doing is TORTURING yourself with a piece of machinery that is (In my opinion) a gimmick anyway. I say this because I have a bio-impedence body fat analysis scale myself. I pay ABSOLUTELY no attention to it's measurements at all, except for the number of pounds. Sometimes I'm not even sure THAT is always accurate.

Now, I know for a fact that on days I exercise I am a lot hungrier on days that I do not exercise. I can also tell you that when you exercise you WILL retain some water as your muscles tear and repair. It comes and it goes just as quickly. If I were you, I would step AWAY from the scale (even if just mentally). You are only frustrating yourself NEEDLESSLY.

I *DO* weigh every single day. AND I have a journal that I've been recording in for over a year now. I ONLY and ONLY write down my weight on Tuesdays. If I'm a lower weight on Wednesday...too bad because I can only count it on Tuesdays. Sometimes it works in my favor, sometimes it doesn't But, I can tell you that in between weighings, my weight (and that body fat %, water %) is all over the place. The general trend is downward over time ... and that is what matters.

If you are truly concerned about body fat percentage (as we all should be) then I suggest every 3-4 months you go get a professional body fat analysis done by either hydrostatic weighing or in what's called the BodPod which uses air displacement instead of water displacement. Those are as close to accurate without MRI type scans to test your body fat %.