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  • Re: Calories still matter, even on a low-carb plan

    Megs check out chapter 16 page 199 in the paperback editon and we see Dr Atkins state in point number 2
    They're startled to discover that without the wonderful advantage of deep lipolysis ( that would be ketosis for ADBBer) appetite suppression has diminsihed.
    He goes on to streess further down the page if you are not skipping meals and continue to lose weight, you are controlling your blood sugar and burning fats so your apetite should npt be out of control. page 200 he discusses eating more food and says that is fine
    BUT heed the lessons you have learned about the difference between being satiated and being stuffed.
    As you can see this is a very very importain lesson to start learning on day one of your Atkins experience.

    Cleo read the post. I highlighted what it says isn't doing atkins.
    I look at it like this since many iof you are arguing that it takes time or they haven't mastered learning to listen to their hunger when refueling. When a newbie tells us they have decided to alter Dr Atkins plan cause they want to eat ________ ,not eat veggies, will not exercise, or give up something Dr Atkins tells them to do we wish them well on THEIR plan but point out it isn't Atkins. So if a newbie decides not to from day one learn about their appetite and hunger control as Dr Atkins told them to in DANDR then are they not doing their own plan too and not his? that is what this comes down to.
    learning our hunger satisfaction point and not our belly stretch receptors point is what Dr Atkins was talking about when he said eat some and stop. if you are hungry in a bit eat a few more bites and stop. Just as he teaches us not to fear the fats (and every low fat cal counting dieter has to overcome that fear when they start) and every veggie hater has to learn to eat them when they start so too is hunger learning just one more REQUIRED part of Induction.

    You can chose to ignore that exercise in eating and do your own program and you will lose until you get to the point your eating exceeds your fuel burning just as Dr Atkins says in DANDR chapter 11 Q and A when he points out any plan where cal burning from all sources doesn't exceed cal intake folk will not lose weight, but again if you don't do what Dr Atkins says to do then you are not doing his plan!
    by the book atkinseer

    started 6/1/02 at 313
    goalie 5/04 at 167 with under 15% body fat ADBB Presidents exercise Challenge


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    • Re: Calories still matter, even on a low-carb plan

      Wanna-- and that is frustrating.

      Atkins IS calorie control due to low-carb making us not hungry. People cannot deny the very reason Atkins works is that we are bringing in less than we are expending.

      No one is saying Atkins is *gasp* a low-cal diet. It's actually a low-cal-low-carb diet.

      I've had a lot of people asking me about calories when they have stalled or slowed considerably. They've adjusted them and started losing again. This is because it works.

      Eating that extra slice of bacon adds up. That extra half-cup of mayonnaise adds up.

      It's about choices, and, as you've said, using all the tools in your shed.

      Calorie consideration isn't anti-Atkins. It is definitely uber-Atkins.

      And go Hockey! *lol*
      ADBB Moderator Emeritus
      My blog: The Lighter Side of Low Carb: Food, fun and fidgeting
      Low Carb Lolitas: Hip low carb bloggers

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      • Re: Calories still matter, even on a low-carb plan

        2big-- If it is truly not doing Atkins, you have literally dozens of people here at ADBB (that I know of) not doing Atkins and continuing to lose weight without hunger, pressure, stress, or feeling confined.

        I'd have to say this is not only doing Atkins, but doing Atkins one better. It's taking what he's already acknowledged and putting it into practice as with the ratios.

        This is the kind of thing we need to look to as a tool when people are struggling.

        I think that's pretty important.
        ADBB Moderator Emeritus
        My blog: The Lighter Side of Low Carb: Food, fun and fidgeting
        Low Carb Lolitas: Hip low carb bloggers

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        • Re: Calories still matter, even on a low-carb plan

          Originally posted by cleochatra
          2big-- If it is truly not doing Atkins, you have literally dozens of people here at ADBB (that I know of) not doing Atkins and continuing to lose weight without hunger, pressure, stress, or feeling confined.

          I'd have to say this is not only doing Atkins, but doing Atkins one better. It's taking what he's already acknowledged and putting it into practice as with the ratios.

          This is the kind of thing we need to look to as a tool when people are struggling.

          I think that's pretty important.
          Yes there are lots of folk doing their own low carb version of Atkins but to give a new to Atkins person the best shot at succeeding we shouls be telling them to use Dr Atkins tools even in stall breaking and the very first thing he says to do if you have examined your eating and you don't have carb creep, it isbn't a medical problem, and you haven't lowered your activity level is to back off your carbs 5 net grams. That is the advice ADBB should be giving stalled folk and if that doesn't work cut it 5 more as Dr Atkins says in chapter 15 of DANDR. and as he says if that doesn't work return to induction for a few days to get deep ketosis. Of course when he tells us to do that he is asuuming we have done the food amount/hunger part of our induction too and are not simply overeating.
          by the book atkinseer

          started 6/1/02 at 313
          goalie 5/04 at 167 with under 15% body fat ADBB Presidents exercise Challenge


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          • Re: Calories still matter, even on a low-carb plan

            Comment


            • Re: Calories still matter, even on a low-carb plan

              ADBB Moderator Emeritus
              My blog: The Lighter Side of Low Carb: Food, fun and fidgeting
              Low Carb Lolitas: Hip low carb bloggers

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              • Re: Calories still matter, even on a low-carb plan

                Originally posted by cleochatra
                Atkins IS calorie control due to low-carb making us not hungry. People cannot deny the very reason Atkins works is that we are bringing in less than we are expending.
                I don't think anyone has disputed this---even Dr. Atkins wrote it in his book in regards to the appetite suppression. So if this whole thread's purpose was to 'prove' that calories matter on Atkins, then it has been a waste of bandwidth, time and energy because not only did the man wrote it in his book that calories do matter and he devoted an entire chapter to it too. Period.

                No one is saying Atkins is *gasp* a low-cal diet. It's actually a low-cal-low-carb diet.

                I've had a lot of people asking me about calories when they have stalled or slowed considerably. They've adjusted them and started losing again. This is because it works.

                Eating that extra slice of bacon adds up. That extra half-cup of mayonnaise adds up.

                It's about choices, and, as you've said, using all the tools in your shed.

                Calorie consideration isn't anti-Atkins. It is definitely uber-Atkins.

                And go Hockey! *lol*
                And again, I think it goes to eating issues developed before starting Atkins or any weight loss diet. If in spite of the appetite suppression of ketosis, you still 'need' to eat 5 eggs and 1/2 pound of bacon to feel "satisfied" with your meal, you really MUST re-evaluate/acknowledge your unhealthy over-eating issues. Until you resolve your over-eating issues, you will never be wholly successful on any weight loss plan because you will be one of those people who read "eat liberally" and interpret that as "Cool! I can gorge myself on an entire 5 pound pot roast and still lose weight!"
                ~Megs~
                242/141/160 (130)
                dress size 26/10/8
                5'4", Female, May 2, 2003
                My blog:
                http://mformiscellaneous.blogspot.com/

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                • Re: Calories still matter, even on a low-carb plan

                  Not one time in the past two years of doing Atkins have I ever counted a single calorie ...and that has been part of what made this work for me ....this is satisfying way to eat..... if you eat well ....from a large variety of wholesome ...foods ....figure out what triggers you as you climb the ladder learn to avoid those things ...it works ...period....part of the charm of all this is NOT having to think so much or obsess about food!
                  if you are a compulsive overeater and obsessive that is the issue you need to deal with ..this diet has nothing to do with that except it does offer more of a satiety factor due to the increased fat and decreased carbs....listen to your body and feed it when you need to eat..then stop when you are full...
                  count calories of you want to but do not make it a priority or why the heck do this at all ..counting carbs, calories, fats..come on this is supposed to relieve you of the burden of the obsessing........

                  Counting calories...as far as I am concerned ...that is not going to happen and I have been at goal with pretty much ease for almost a year now....this is the first time in my life I have not had to loose any weight for this long a period..and I can tell you that next year at this time..I will still weigh the same and I will still not be counting calories ...or anything else for that matter...

                  I will just be eating the most wonderful food and enjoying the freedom from obesession ...with anything but the pleasure of a good meal

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                  • Re: Calories still matter, even on a low-carb plan

                    2big,

                    i am wondering what you are trying to accomplish in this thread - wouldn't you agree that using additional tools that do not contradict the plan is beneficial? ratios are beneficial, aren't they? i understand that, for you, calorie counting is not necessary, and that's fantastic. but if some find it is helpful, or necessary, is there really harm there? i'm sure you are trying to help here, but the calorie counters have found what works for them, and you have found what works for you, and it's all sunshine and lollipops.


                    -jen

                    female, 32, 5'6"

                    start date: december 30 2005
                    200/175/125


                    here's my journal!

                    Comment


                    • Re: Calories still matter, even on a low-carb plan

                      Originally posted by cleochatra

                      very profound statement

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                      • Re: Calories still matter, even on a low-carb plan

                        Heidi-- it's just a tool. Not one people have to use, just as people don't have to use the percentages to gauge fat, protein and carb intakes. Sorry if you took offense to humor. Humor is a good thing.

                        megs-- I don't think we're going to necessarily agree here; that doesn't make either one of us wrong. I think it just shows that there are many ways to gauge success on this way of eating.

                        That's pretty wonderful!

                        {{{Blue Skies}}} What a wonderful post. I agree. It is not a fight to the intellectual death. I appreciate your contribution. Amen!

                        If people want to use it, it's an option. Calorie counting is an option. And it works for many of us.

                        ADBB Moderator Emeritus
                        My blog: The Lighter Side of Low Carb: Food, fun and fidgeting
                        Low Carb Lolitas: Hip low carb bloggers

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                        • Re: Calories still matter, even on a low-carb plan

                          Here's a link to Binge Eating Disorder (AKA Compulsive Eating Disorder):
                          http://www.4woman.gov/faq/bingeeating.htm

                          Do any of the criterion describe you pre-Atkins?
                          Do any of the criterion describe you now?
                          ~Megs~
                          242/141/160 (130)
                          dress size 26/10/8
                          5'4", Female, May 2, 2003
                          My blog:
                          http://mformiscellaneous.blogspot.com/

                          Comment


                          • Re: Calories still matter, even on a low-carb plan

                            Here's a link to Binge Eating Disorder (AKA Compulsive Eating Disorder):
                            http://www.4woman.gov/faq/bingeeating.htm

                            Do any of the criterion describe you pre-Atkins?
                            Do any of the criterion describe you now?
                            Red Herring. Off-Topic. And ouch-- a little personal, don't you think?

                            ADBB Moderator Emeritus
                            My blog: The Lighter Side of Low Carb: Food, fun and fidgeting
                            Low Carb Lolitas: Hip low carb bloggers

                            Comment


                            • Re: Calories still matter, even on a low-carb plan

                              Originally posted by cleochatra
                              Red Herring. Off-Topic. And ouch-- a little personal, don't you think?

                              Not meant to be personal. My post to that link is for everyone and anyone reading this thread who has probelms controlling their appetite or know their level of satiety in spite of the ketotic appetite suppression. There's a reason why ketosis isn't helping 100% and that reason is most likely due to the tendency to compulsively overeating.
                              ~Megs~
                              242/141/160 (130)
                              dress size 26/10/8
                              5'4", Female, May 2, 2003
                              My blog:
                              http://mformiscellaneous.blogspot.com/

                              Comment


                              • Re: Calories still matter, even on a low-carb plan

                                Originally posted by not2late
                                Here's a link to Binge Eating Disorder (AKA Compulsive Eating Disorder):
                                http://www.4woman.gov/faq/bingeeating.htm

                                Do any of the criterion describe you pre-Atkins?
                                Do any of the criterion describe you now?
                                sorry megs, but what exactly is the point of this?


                                -jen

                                female, 32, 5'6"

                                start date: december 30 2005
                                200/175/125


                                here's my journal!

                                Comment

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